Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

Scratch said:

The plan sais 11 of those Fords will be built through 2058. With currently built CVNs planned to last 50 yrs, by the time the navy commissions the last -78, it will then only have one class of carriers. If they stick to the 11 super-carriers plan.
But obviously the navy thinks it will do well with just one class in over half a century. With todays defence costs you have to plan long ahead and I'm sure further developments can and will be introduced through incremental upgrades. But still it's the same class.
Has carrier building (in the US) come to a point where no further revolutionary developments that would make a new class are to be exspected within that time span? Or is it likely that in perhaps 30-40 yrs we'll see a completely new class of carriers with less the 11 Fords built?
I guess alot will also depend on how the UA(C)V part develops.

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Scratch said:

Thanks popeye.

Any news on LHA-6 lately. I.e. how serious / close is the navy to using nuclear propulsion in those ships as well. The first of class will pretty sure get gas turbines I guess, but later on ...?
And how difficult would it be to put a small cat and arresting wires for CTOL UAVs on such a ship?

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USS MAKIN ISLAND (LHD 8) is currently under construction by Northrop Grumman Ship Systems in Pascagoula, Mississippi. MAKIN ISLAND will be the last LHD built in the WASP Class but will be the only one powered by LM 2500+ Gas Turbine Engines and Electric Drive. Additionally, MAKIN ISLAND is the only LHD to feature an all electric design -- no steam is used onboard MAKIN ISLAND. As the final member of the WASP Class LHD's, MAKIN ISLAND is transforming the U.S. Navy Amphibious Forces and setting the stage for the under-development successor to the Wasp Class, the LHA (R) Class of Amphibious Landing Ship.

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YOKOSUKA, Japan (Sept. 25, 2008) The aircraft carrier USS George Washington (CVN 73) arrives at Fleet Activities Yokosuka, Japan. George Washington and Carrier Air Wing 5 will be operating from Fleet Activities Yokosuka as the U.S. Navy's only forward-deployed aircraft carrier. U.S. Navy photo Kuji Kawabe (Released)

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YOKOSUKA, Japan (Sept. 25, 2008) Sailors aboard the aircraft carrier USS George Washington (CVN 73) form the phrase "Hajimemashite," which means "Nice to meet you" in Japanese, as they arrive at Fleet Activities Yokosuka, Japan. U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Clifford L. H. Davis (Released)

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£235M Contracts Propel Carrier Project Forward
UK Ministry of Defence | Oct 8, 2008

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The Ministry of Defence has placed £235m of contracts with industry to provide power and propulsion equipment for the new Royal Navy aircraft carriers it was confirmed today, Monday 6 October 2008.

At 65,000 tonnes each, HMS Queen Elizabeth and HMS Prince of Wales will be among the world's largest warships. The latest contracts will deliver the carriers' gas turbines, generators, motors, power distribution equipment, platform management systems, propellers, shafts, steering gear, rudders and stabilisers.

Simultaneously, the key industrial suppliers involved have co-operated to form an alliance that will ensure the equipment is integrated into the ships in the most cost-effective manner.

Each carrier's propellers will be driven by two powerful electric motors, making them the largest warships in the world to use electric rather than mechanical drive technology. The electric motors will be powered by diesel- and gas-turbine-driven generators which can be located elsewhere within the ship, freeing up valuable space in the hull and providing greater resilience to battle damage.

The electric propulsion technology will be provided by Scots-based companies Rolls Royce in Fife and Converteam in Glasgow.

Rolls Royce's Dalgety Bay facilty will benefit from a £13m contract to provide rudders and stabilisers which steer the ship and keep it level. Overall, Rolls Royce's share of the latest carrier contracts is £96m.

Power conversion specialists Converteam will be providing the electric equipment which controls and monitors the power for the propulsion system and motors, under a contract worth £26m. This involves making medium-voltage switchboards, electric converters, and filters.

Two state-of-the-art gas turbines for each ship will be built in Bristol - producing 70 mega watts (MW) of power - and will be coupled to generators to be built in Rugby. Combined with the diesel engines already on order, they will supply the enormous amounts of electricity each carrier needs to move through the water fast enough to launch and recover aircraft, and to power onboard systems such as lighting and heating. In all each ship will be capable of generating some 109 MW, enough power to supply a town the size of Swindon.

MOD Defence Equipment and Support Director General Ships, Rear Admiral Bob Love, said:

"The new carriers represent a series of firsts for the Fleet and this latest propulsion technology has not yet been seen in the Royal Navy on this scale.

"This is a step change in the way our ships are powered and, as well as boosting capacity, will significantly improve fuel efficiency enabling uninterrupted long distance deployments and reducing running costs."

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Big naval war game of the Northern Fleet is part of the Stability-2008 exercise. The Comrade President Dimitri Medvedev, flew out to the air craft carrying cruiser the Admiral of the Fleet of the USSR Kuznetsov from whose bridge he witnessed the ongoing exercise. The conclusion of the wargame saw the SSBN Tula firing one of its Sineva missiles from the Barent sea to the Pacific ocean. The missile traveled a record 11,500+ km's.

It should be noted that NATO submarines were observed nearby. The comrade president did not comment on their presence so close to Russian territorial waters...

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September 28, 2008

Britain considers £9bn JSF project pullout

Michael Smith

BRITAIN is considering pulling out of a £9 billion project with America to produce the new Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) aircraft, intended to fly off the Royal Navy’s forthcoming aircraft carriers.

The move is part of an increasingly desperate attempt to plug a £1.5 billion shortfall in the defence budget. The RAF’s 25 new Airbus A400 transport aircraft could also be at risk.

Studies have now been commissioned to analyse whether Eurofighters could be adapted to fly off the carriers.

If Britain abandons the JSF, it will be seen as a further snub to the Americans following Gordon Brown’s decision last week not to send 4,000 more troops to Afghanistan.

Only a week earlier, during a visit to London, Robert Gates, the American defence secretary, had said he understood Britain would be sending more troops to meet what commanders say is a 10,000 shortfall.

The possible ditching of the JSF results in part from spiralling costs that have seen the price of the planned 150 British aircraft rise from the original £9 billion estimate to £15 billion.

Britain has already paid out £2.5 billion in preliminary costs but next spring must start paying for actual aircraft. At that point it is committed to the entire project whatever the price.

Once full production begins, Britain will be paying more than £1 billion a year for the aircraft, exacerbating the already dire state of the Ministry of Defence (MoD) budget.

“That has really concentrated minds at the MoD,” said Francis Tusa, editor of Defence Analysis. “Put simply no-one has the faintest idea how much this project will cost.”

The cost is only part of the problem. There is serious concern over the aircraft’s lack of firepower as it can only carry three 500lb bombs, compared with as many as eight on the Eurofighter.

There is also increasing frustration over the continued American refusal to share information on the technology involved.

President George Bush signed a deal with Tony Blair shortly before the former prime minister handed over to Gordon Brown, promising to share top secret technology with Britain.

The deal has still to be ratified by Congress and the Senate foreign relations committee has written to Bush warning him it will not now be ratified until the new president takes office.

There is consternation over the lack of information Britain is receiving on the aircraft and this country’s lack of input into designing its capability.

BAE Systems, manufacturer of the RAF’s Eurofighter, has been asked to produce a study into whether it could be flown from the carriers, which are due to enter service in 2014 and 2016.

The JSF is a short-take-off-and-vertical-landing (STOVL) aircraft similar to the Harrier aircraft that are currently being flown off the Royal Navy’s two old carriers.

Flying Eurofighter from the new carriers would require pilots to learn a completely new skill of landing conventionally at sea — a task likened by experts to a “controlled crash”.

It would also require the Eurofighter fuselage to be strengthened, the attachment of an arrestor hook to stop the aircraft on landing, and protection against saltwater erosion.

The BAE Systems study, carried out earlier this year, determined that the aircraft could be built to land on carriers without major difficulty.

A company spokesman would only confirm that the study had been carried out and that the MoD had seen the results which confirmed the aircraft could be adapted to fly off carriers.

Replacing JSF with some of the 232 Eurofighters the RAF is committed to buying would be attractive for the Treasury, which has always wanted to find ways to cut its £16 billion cost.

The deal committed all four major partners — Britain, Germany, Italy and Spain — to paying for all the aircraft they originally ordered even if they later decided to cut the numbers they needed.

The cost of the project, now running at close to £1.2 billion a year, is the biggest single contributor to the £1.5 billion shortfall in the defence budget.

Efforts to stave off the payments dragged the government into the controversy over the decision to call off a Serious Fraud Office investigation into alleged bribes paid by BAE Systems.

The probe into the company’s £43 billion al-Yamamah arms deal with Saudi Arabia was expected to examine the bank accounts of members of the Saudi royal family.

A £6 billion deal under which Saudi Arabia agreed to take 72 Eurofighters from Britain — earning the MoD a two-year payments holiday on its own aircraft — was dependent on the probe being called off.

That has only served to focus attention on the fact that when the payments holiday ends, Britain will be committed to a decade of paying well in excess of £2 billion a year for two different strike aircraft.

The additional measure of cancelling the military version of the Airbus A400 would only save a total of £1.5 billion but is attractive to the Treasury because it would cost nothing.

The aircraft has consistently failed to meet deadlines with manufacturer EADS admitting last week that it could not meet the deadline for the first test flight.

“The RAF and the MoD would prefer to enforce penalty clauses providing compensation for delays while continuing with the project,” said defence sources. “But the Treasury would happily bin it.”

The MoD said “marinising” Eurofighter had been looked at as an option but “JSF remains our optimum solution to fly off the carriers”.

A spokesman said Britain remained “fully committed to the defence trade cooperation treaty and we are working closely with the American administration to find a way forward.”

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