Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

harryRIEDL said:

but it wouldn't be trickle you wouldn't want to be stuck with an international incident say Falklands take two and only have a qualified 10 pilots out of a fleet of 36 so you can't matian CAP and Strike you want at least a carriers worth of pilots ASAP

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I think the Brits will want to make a decision regarding whenever if they want their carriers to be STOVL or CATOBAR soon; as soon a decision is made, the sooner things can get started. The USN has plenty of space for allied pilots to gain carrier proficiency; as mentioned before, all of the USN carriers are operating below their design capabilities.

Once the initial cadre of pilots are trained just prior to the commissioning of QE, only a trickle of aircrew needs to be in training at any given time, pretty much as it is now. Pilots and crew of JFH will need to start the conversion process at some point anyway, and this will most likely start with 20sqn which is 50/50 RN/RAF manned and handles all flight training and conversion work for JFH. Currently the NSW is due to recieve the F-35s first, and I think the Navy will use this opportunity to reform 801NAS officially. During the conversion process I think the NSW will revert back to it's original identity of 800NAS to continue Harrier ops for a short while until 801 is declared operational, after which 800 will convert followed by 1sqn and IV sqn. Just my opinion...

CARQUALS..now that's a word I've not seen or uttered in many a year..Translation for those of you navally challenged;

CARQUALS..Carrier Qualifications..each pilot is required to perform so many carrier cat shots and arrested landings. Also know as FCLP..Fleet Carrier Landing pratice.

crobato posted these photos in another thread as thumbnails..They were too good to pass up. Nice find crobato!

About 10 days ago there was an display of the RKN Dokodo..In Busan I believe..nice pics!

Some interesting pictures of Gorskov

looking at the 08 images its in a terrible matiral condition there are scraped ships in better condition

harryRIEDL said:

Some interesting pictures of Gorskov

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looking at the 08 images its in a terrible matiral condition there are scraped ships in better condition

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Great find harryRIEDL!!

Those photos really shows the progress or lack there of on the ship. The newer photos show a nice start of a paint job. Those photos are in the upper left corner of the page. I know earlier this year I read an article that the ships delivery to the IN could be delayed for two years. Then a few days later the IN denied the story. Anyone have any ideas on the latest on this ship??

Once again ..Great find harryRIEDL!! OUTSTANDING!

Latest news seem to say India won't get Groshkov before the end of 2012 and will have to pay an additional $2B over the original $1.5B for the carrier and 16 MiG-29Ks. Recently the order of 29 more MiGs has been approved.
Apperently the Indian govt is to take a final decission this month.

Here are some photos from that Russian Google link..

As Scratch posted >>> INS Vikramarka is being delayed a couple of more years and about $2 Billion US dollars worth of more expense..

More pix ..

IN Vikramarka. 2008 photos

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A model of the Vikramarka

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Here's the latest on the re-fit INS Vikramarka of the by the Russians. Bad news for the IN. I really feel it was a poor choice by the IN to have the Russian re-fit this ship. For what they are paying they could have had a new carrier. Perhaps they should have gone to Spain or Italy for their new carrier. What do you CV fans think???

Russia submits revised refit schedule, cost escalation fee of $1.2 billion for INS Vikramaditya news.

22 October 2008

The Government informed Rajya Sabha member Dr T Subbarami Reddy that Russia had submitted a revised master schedule, as well as an increase in price, for the repair and re-fitting of aircraft carrier INS Vikramaditya (ex-Admiral Gorshkov).

The revised schedule indicates a delay and the price escalation, as proposed by the Russian side, for repair, re-equipping, spares and training and other items stands at $1.202 billion.

Defence minister AK Antony informed the Rajya Sabha member that technical evaluation was underway currently and no cost negotiations had been initiated in this regard.

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bd popeye said:

Here's the latest on the re-fit INS Vikramarka of the by the Russians. Bad news for the IN. I really feel it was a poor choice by the IN to have the Russian re-fit this ship. For what they are paying they could have had a new carrier. Perhaps they should have gone to Spain or Italy for their new carrier. What do you CV fans think???

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This deal is all about benefitting the Russians at the Indians' expense (literally). The whole idea was to get a carrier to sea as quickly as possible to replace Viraat (ex-Hermes) and bridge the gap until the New Indigenous Aircraft Carrier project could bear fruit. Now it looks like th IAC will be ready around the same time as Vikramaditya. Meanwhile the Russians are using this project as a training ground for their engineers and shipyard workers, learning all the necessary lessons and making the inevitable mistakes on someone elses ship before they start work on their own new generation of Aircraft Carriers. Personally I think the Indians would have been better advised to have joined the CVF program a few years ago, as they would be able to take the design and build it a lot cheaper in their own shipyards (possibly even picking up a degree of subcontract work for the British and French ships).

The basic problem with the Kiev class is that they weren't designed as true aircraft carriers (by this I mean a ship designed to serve the needs of it's air group assuming the aircraft to be the ship's primary weapon system) but were evolved from a culture of missile cruiser design with a hangar and 2/3 length flightdeck shoehorned onto one side, but retaining the oversized superstructure and heavy missile armament forward,- which was the primary weapon system of these vessels. Thus in this context I would agree with the Soviet description of the Kievs as 'Tactical Aviation Cruisers', not aircraft carriers. Kuznetzov is different, their is still a heavy missile battery but the installation and indeed the overall design gives priority to the needs of the air group so these two ships are more deserving of the title Aircraft Carrier than 'Aviation Cruiser' (or whatever is popular this week).