You already have a new 052D being built, pushing the technological edge on the 055 program would make the most of this program if embarked. So it wouldn't just be IEPS. There's still the CCC you've talked about needing development, a more advanced sonar (which can serve the 054B program too if there is one), and more automation.
052D can be produced serially with confidence because the vessel itself has already been proven with 052C for a decade. Structural components such as hull and propulsion have not changed. With an 055, the basic premise is a much larger hull, needing a new propulsion system. Those are not tasks to take lightly even if the design is more conventional that Zumwalt. The other systems if not re-used from 052D can at least be developed using the test ships. But you need to eventually build and test hulls which is why it makes sense 055 initially be produced in limited numbers. By the time it reaches a state of mass production, there'll be enough tweaks for it to be 055A or 055B, whatever they want to call it since 054 went to 054A but 052 never went to 052A but 052B instead.
With regards to 052D's serial production confidence versus 055, we should remember that while 052D uses a "common hull," many of its subsystems are still new. Yes it shares propulsion with second batch of 052C (QC-280) but virtually everything else on the outside is different.
We can also be fairly confident in seeing a new generation of command control and CIC aboard 052D compared to 052C as well. Yet the addition of all new subsystems from weapons to internals has not dissuaded the PLAN from jumping into serial production.
055 by all accounts may use the same QC-280 gas turbines, four of them, which may or may not be hooked up to QC-280. Most of the subsystems from radar to VLS to main gun will be mature from 052D. The only "new" aspect of 055 will be its hull, its new generation of internal electronics and command/control, and possibly/hopefully IEPS.
You're right, these aren't tasks to take lightly, but they are also not tasks which other nations are unable to mass produce. The UK's Type 45 featured an entirely new hull, entirely new everything from radar to SAM to command/control, yet they jumped straight into serial production.
If you want to consider Zumwalt as being serially produced at three, what is your definition of serial production vs limited production? Cutoff at two? Personally, I consider serial production as something exceeding one round of order and more than three. 052C was limited production till the recent additional four more, which I would now consider a short serial production.
Perhaps serial production wasn't the right word. My meaning was that Zumwalt production is being stopped due to monetary factors, not "produce three first, test out the systems and then continue production".
But thinking about it, zumwalt probably isn't the best example (refer to previous type 45 example instead lol)
I'm confused by this point of yours. I've never argued that there isn't a need for an eventual 055. I believe the main driving force for that is a need for an even better platform than the 052D on distant solo missions. Earlier, you stated CVBGs as the main driving need. But in a CVBG, the admiral would be planting his flag on the carrier.
I respectfully disagree that the main driving force for a cruiser is distant solo missions. What kind of missions will a solo 055 be able to accomplish or be expected to accomplish which an 052D cannot? Anti piracy? Showing the flag? Or raining down cruise missiles at some random third world country? Because the first two can be done with 052/C/D or even 054/A. The last will not be executed with only a lone 055.
As for CVBGs being the main driving need, what I actually said was "CVBG or any other large taskforce". I'm not trying to be technical here, and I recognize I may have been unclear, so I'll clarify.
I believe the main driving need for a cruiser sized ship is the need for more comprehensive defensive and offensive and command and control capabilities, that is to say, it can be used either in a CVBG or SAG or ARGs.
(as for flag planting, there are various reasons why an admiral may or may not make a carrier his flagship versus a cruiser)
Umm....that's been my point all along. That's why I asked if having an 055 in a CVBG is any better off than having a bunch of 052Ds in the CVBG.
I believe you were saying 2 052Ds could equal the offensive and defensive capabilities of an 055, and you later said the advantage 055 offered was endurance/range.
The part you quoted, is me positing an example where 052D and 054A could have as much practical endurance as an 055 in a CVBG, but would lack the combat capabilities which such a ship offers.
I never was alluding to anti-piracy missions. I was referring to growing Chinese interests far and away in places like Africa. Chinese citizens there, business investments, etc etc.
I see, could you elaborate as to how an 055 would protect chinese interests in such far regions? I imagine it can show the flag, but that's about all a lone 055 can do. No lone 055 can single handedly cruise missile the snot out of even a small third world country.
So I'm really confused, is your position that 055 is needed or not needed?
055 is definitely needed, but not because PLAN needs a ship to solo deploy in far seas (which seems to be your position?)
I'll try to summarize my position:
055 is necessary for its enhanced offensive and defensive capabilities, and the reason PLAN needs such a vessel (compared to other smaller navies) is due to the highly capable foes it may face.
Such a high threat environment may exst in ECS or SCS, as far as the indian ocean.
While 055 will have greater endurance compared to 052D or 054A, the "solo" missions 055 can provide in the indian ocean and off africa can also be performed by 052C/D 054/A, as all three types of ships would be accompanied by an AOR anyway.
My bringing up ROKN and JMSDF ships was to illustrate how they also have large, highly capable destroyer/cruisers, yet are only deploying them in near seas because their immediate interests only span the region.
The PLAN will be slightly different as its interests will soon span all the way to africa. What will not be different is that the reason PLAN, ROKN, and JMSDF have such large and capable ships, is their primary desire for high offensive and defensive capability in their relevant theaters of action.
