1:yes
2: yes, it is a licensed, and improved version
055 DDG Large Destroyer Thread
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1:yes
2: yes, it is a licensed, and improved version
Jura The idiot
General
great
to ask you if you could comment on an improved version of QC280 which would have
oh and feel free to tell me if it's nonsense what I read, no problem about that
I was editing my preceding post
to ask you if you could comment on an improved version of QC280 which would have- an increased output,
- a lower fuel consumption,
- a higher reliability
oh and feel free to tell me if it's nonsense what I read, no problem about that
I do think there is a quantitative difference in nature with Russia and the Al-31Fs, which is that those engines are meant for mostly supplying J-10s (a few J-11Bs initially, but replaced with WS-10 of course). Those Al-31Fs power J-10s on a one to one basis (with the need for spares of course also an unavoidable fact) -- but gas turbines which power 052D and 055 respectively are two and four, respectively.
For each given ship they are committing more given powerplants. That may not be a problem if the supply of DN-80s is judged as reliable for the number of ships that they are planning in whatever span of time they're looking to, but if the supply of DN-80s was judged as various increments of unreliable then I think that is a different matter.
So I believe it is also entirely reasonable to speculate that if QC-280 had not been ready, the calculus regarding the use of DN-80s and the plans for future 052D and 055 construction may have taken a different form, especially if the supply of DN-80 was judged as varying degrees of unreliable.
great
I was editing my preceding post
(it's based on what I read in a Polish naval journal from 2014 (LOL I know I mentioned it already twice above), which said such a version was being developed by "Xian", and should be installed on "a new generation of Chinese Destroyers" -- I'm guessing it would mean Type 055)
- an increased output,
- a lower fuel consumption,
- a higher reliability
oh and feel free to tell me if it's nonsense what I read, no problem about that
QC-280 is listed as having 28MW; early models that they tried to produce might have had lower output for whatever reasons, but the mass production models are mostly said to be 28MW I think. I imagine further improved variants are also probably in development
I can't speculate on fuel consumption or reliability too much, but I assume they meet the Navy's needs... and probably not worse than DN-80 at least.
Jura The idiot
General
got a problem here:
what type of propulsion Type will get? I mean Type 052D is CODOG, Type 055:
what type of propulsion Type will get? I mean Type 052D is CODOG, Type 055:
Jura The idiot
General
LOL I did a google search first, of course, but several top hits were sending me to ... this thread!
Huh? AFAIK J-11Bs, J-15s, J-16s, and J-20s are also all powered by AL-31Fs, all of them dual-engine aircraft. We have yet to visually confirm any fighters being serially produced with WS-10A/B/whatever engines.
"For each given aircraft they are committing more given powerplants. That may not be a problem if the supply of AL-31Fs is judged as reliable for the number of fighters that they are planning in whatever span of time they're looking to, but if the supply of AL-31Fs was judged as various increments of unreliable then I think that is a different matter."
So the question is, have they judged the supply of AL-31Fs as any increment of unreliable enough to halt, delay or modify their fighter programs and do you have any shred of evidence to demonstrate this?
You can speculate it sure, but evidence from the history of actual practice of both the PLAAF and the PLAN goes against your speculation. Unless you can demonstrate that ANY Chinese naval or aviation program was delayed by lack of domestic engines (that's a pretty low bar I'm setting for you) when there was a foreign engine available, your theory remains just a theory.
Whoa, what?
All SAC produced J-11Bs after the first regiment, and all J-16s have been powered by WS-10s...
This is one of the most important factual pillars that discussions about SAC Flankers and the overall state of WS-10 engines and Chinese engine development, all revolve around.
The only domestically produced twin engine airframes relying on Al-31s are the first regiment of J-11Bs, current STOBAR J-15s, and J-20s.
Still, the direct relevance of this is to the 055 discusison is not that great.
Sure; and in this case I think it is likely that China's been able to get a good deal with Russian suppliers and judged the reliability to be sufficient for their needs.
Sigh. I've never claimed it was anything other than a theory...
I'm not even saying that the potential lack of availability of QC-280 would have necessarily delayed development 055.
I'm only saying that the lack of availability of QC-280 and the reliance on DN-80 may have resulted in differing plans and projections for 055 (such as how many would've been built in what amount of time), depending on the reliability of supply of DN-80s. I think this is a very broad statement to make, and is very non-commital and broad to fulfill the prerequisites for being logically acceptable.
Then this is news to me. That still leaves J15s and J-20s, both dual-engined fighters, still using AL-31Fs though.
If that's really all you're saying, then it's a statement similar to "China would prefer domestic engines to foreign engines given similar parameters" in obviousness. Why even talk about it, then? Sure, if the Ukraine were overrun by Russia, China may actually think about changing plans WRT DN-80 and thus 055 procurement. That would have been a most stunning feat of logical deduction by China.
What has been under discussion is definitively NOT that. What you were trying to imply earlier was that without any obvious likelihood of DN-80 shortage, China would have halted, delayed and/or modified plans regarding 055 procurement simply because it was a foreign DN-80 that was being used rather than a domestic QC-280. That is why I brought up the fighter programs with their mass purchases of AL-31Fs despite being foreign engines with absolutely NO concurrent evidence of slowdown in any of the fighter programs that depend on this foreign engine.
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