052/052B Class Destroyers
- Thread starter tphuang
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franco-russe
Senior Member
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Yes, I think we have. If you look at the GE update of Jiangnan 27.07.11, you probably see the sections for Hull 8 at 31 20 59 N 121 44 29 E.
Yes, I think we have. If you look at the GE update of Jiangnan 27.07.11, you probably see the sections for Hull 8 at 31 20 59 N 121 44 29 E.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Just depends on what oyu want the CSG to accomplish. If it is just airctraft strike at sea, then yes, ytou could do without it. If it to add significant surface strike capabilities to augment the air arm, and with the ASW support, then a Sov makes sense.
I'm doing it to show the full breadth of capabilities the PLAN has developed.
It adds significant surface combat/attack capabilities and significant ASW capabilities to the overall group.
Just depends on what oyu want the CSG to accomplish. If it is just airctraft strike at sea, then yes, ytou could do without it. If it to add significant surface strike capabilities to augment the air arm, and with the ASW support, then a Sov makes sense.
I'm doing it to show the full breadth of capabilities the PLAN has developed.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Japanese MSDF has gotten pretty good at spotting chinese naval surface groups transiting first island chain, usually with SOvs as flag ship and 053 and 054/A as part of the group. so yest they do operate together.
Chinese Sovs has chinese datalinks installed.
May be reason Sovs are not sent on anti-piracy is may be they are fuel thirsty, they require heavier/different oil fuels than 054/052, and their helo facility is a joke.
Japanese MSDF has gotten pretty good at spotting chinese naval surface groups transiting first island chain, usually with SOvs as flag ship and 053 and 054/A as part of the group. so yest they do operate together.
Chinese Sovs has chinese datalinks installed.
May be reason Sovs are not sent on anti-piracy is may be they are fuel thirsty, they require heavier/different oil fuels than 054/052, and their helo facility is a joke.
franco-russe
Senior Member
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
The SOVREMENNYY's were never meant to be escort vessels for high-value units, neither in the Soviet Navy nor in PLAN.
The surface action groups centered on the SOVREMENNYY's that operate beyond the First Island Chain, as mentioned by i.e., give an indication of their role.
The SOVREMENNYY's were never meant to be escort vessels for high-value units, neither in the Soviet Navy nor in PLAN.
The surface action groups centered on the SOVREMENNYY's that operate beyond the First Island Chain, as mentioned by i.e., give an indication of their role.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Exactly. It offers an opportunity to show off several PLAN high value, high capability units together.
BTW, Trumpeter does have a Type 051C 1/350 scale model and I am thinking about getting it and adding it to the group too.
Then I would have the Carrier, a Type 052C, a Type 051C, a Type 052B, a Sov 956EM, and Two Type 054As. A very strong grouping. Probably have the Carrier, the Sov and the Type 051C in the inner ring, have the Type 052C out on the major threat Axis with one of the Type 054As for ASW,, and have the other Type 054A on a scondary threat axis, a little closer in... :>)
Depending on the requirements of the mission, there are many times when CSGs and SAGs are combined...that's my only point. I am putting together a CSG that will do that...mainly to show off the PLANs high value and most effective units. the Sov 956EMs are modern, very worthy combatants, and if they were involved in a CSG where additional SAG and ASW assetts were needed, they could easily be a part of such a group on a one-off basis.
Exactly. It offers an opportunity to show off several PLAN high value, high capability units together.
The Suburns are effective and were atually designed to attack carriers...just depends on how close you can get. But the real issue is whether the particular requirements of a CSG could use a SAG component...and they can and do. it is not uncommon to have CSGs and SAGs combined for manuevers and teraining Ops, or in the real world for combat.
The Sovs had the PLAN data link installed, I am 95% sure of this.
Agreed. It may be very infrequent that they are a par tof such a group, but they certainly can be used in certain operational requirements and circumstances. For me, it allows me to show off those vessels.
BTW, Trumpeter does have a Type 051C 1/350 scale model and I am thinking about getting it and adding it to the group too.
Then I would have the Carrier, a Type 052C, a Type 051C, a Type 052B, a Sov 956EM, and Two Type 054As. A very strong grouping. Probably have the Carrier, the Sov and the Type 051C in the inner ring, have the Type 052C out on the major threat Axis with one of the Type 054As for ASW,, and have the other Type 054A on a scondary threat axis, a little closer in... :>)
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re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
The problem is weapons range mismatch. Sov's SSMs actually has much shorter range than 054 (c803), not to mention 052c (c602).
And carriers wants to keep as far away as possible from surface threats. As such, Sov will work best in independent group, not as a port of CSG.
The problem is weapons range mismatch. Sov's SSMs actually has much shorter range than 054 (c803), not to mention 052c (c602).
And carriers wants to keep as far away as possible from surface threats. As such, Sov will work best in independent group, not as a port of CSG.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
The Sov 956EMs are a very strong and capable modern combatant. Either in a individual SAG, or when grouped with other groups like an Amphibios group or a CSG under the right circumstances.
IN the scenario you described...that is correct. But there are many, many varied scenarios where a SAG component can augment a CSG. For such occassions, I have a Sov attached to my model CSG. That's all. Probably rarely happen, but it could happen and the all-round capabilities of the Sov will make them a good asset in such a scenario.
The Sov 956EMs are a very strong and capable modern combatant. Either in a individual SAG, or when grouped with other groups like an Amphibios group or a CSG under the right circumstances.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Jeff.
I do get the impression that soviets intended to use SOVs in the close confines of Baltic and Black sea.
their 130mm guns were the biggest on soviet ships since the last of Old Kotlins and sverdlov class cruisers. which indicate fire support roles
their armament and defensive suits definitely trends towards close and fast action. Is that impression valid.
Same thing with first island chain. they are all based in Zhoushan and used as center of SAGs to sortie out from Zhoushan naval base on East China coast just south of shanghai, into trilateral area south of pusan, north of taiwan and east shanghai, west of okinanwa.
Jeff.
I do get the impression that soviets intended to use SOVs in the close confines of Baltic and Black sea.
their 130mm guns were the biggest on soviet ships since the last of Old Kotlins and sverdlov class cruisers. which indicate fire support roles
their armament and defensive suits definitely trends towards close and fast action. Is that impression valid.
Same thing with first island chain. they are all based in Zhoushan and used as center of SAGs to sortie out from Zhoushan naval base on East China coast just south of shanghai, into trilateral area south of pusan, north of taiwan and east shanghai, west of okinanwa.