East China Sea Air Defense ID Zone

[luhai]

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PLA spokesperson Luo Yuan confirmed that the aircraft intercepted was of Japanese origin.

The news appears to be back on the official site with the same old pictures, however the part about two planes come WVR, but there is no report of climbing and turning match or the plane was evicted. However, the prose is the same from previous report, just have a few paragraphs removed, very strange.

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解放军报宁波1月31日电 大年初一，东南沿海某机场，不闻鞭炮声，军营的年味融入了浓浓的硝烟味。

上午9时35分，“丁零零……”东海舰队航空兵某飞行团作战值班室电话骤然响起：“某空域出现不明目标，命你们紧急起飞。”

“一等转进！”急促的警报声让机场的气氛陡然紧张起来，外场值班人员如猛虎下山冲出塔台，担负值班任务的副大队长任全胜和飞行员严军、耿艳飞、杨楠，披挂整齐冲向战机。

“起飞！”随着指挥员一声令下，松刹车、开加力、拉驾驶杆，双机拖着蓝色尾焰呼啸着腾空而去，以最快速度飞向目标空域。

“方位××，距离××，航向××！”这时，耳机里及时传来目标信息。“明白！”任全胜和耿艳飞调整飞行姿态向目标飞去。

他们瞪大双眼仔细搜索天空。突然，任全胜眼前一亮，发现前方出现一个亮点。“发现目标！”拉杆蹬舵，战机像一道闪电直追过去。

12时23分，战机编队圆满完成任务顺利返航。官兵们并未放松警惕，继续在节日期间保持箭在弦上、引而待发的战备状态。

 

[Blitzo]

Correction. All F-15Js are BVR capable. The problem is that the majority only support older generation missiles like the AIM-7 Sparrow that requires continuous target illumination throughout the duration of the launch.

Yes I say ARH/BVR, meaning to specify that they do not have BVR active radar homing missiles.
Earlier in the post I mention they do have AIM-7 SARH missiles, which most people recognize as BVR capable (although I suppose I should've specified that as SARH/BVR for consistency's sake).

 

[Air Force Brat]

The report said that there was a climbing and turning match before the intruding aircraft disengaged when they weren't able to shake off the flankers.

Nice way to start off a new year.

Like I said this is a lot of fun, happy New Year guys!

 

[port_08]

The report said that there was a climbing and turning match before the intruding aircraft disengaged when they weren't able to shake off the flankers.

Nice way to start off a new year.

Japan already have the Wind Rises, China might as well have a Top Gun Sequel coming soon..

 

[DaKai]

Japan already have the Wind Rises, China might as well have a Top Gun Sequel coming soon..

Wind Rises is somehow anti-war and left-wingish, if we are looking for a well-produced patriotic militarism propaganda about IJN warbirds, The Eternal Zero would be a better choice.

Anyway, China had already made 《冲天飞豹(Fight Bomb, 1999)》 and 《歼十出击(Sky Fighters J-10, 2011)》, but they are horrible...
Personally, I think 《长空比翼(A Pilot,1958)》 is the best Air Force Chinese movie so far...

 

[port_08]

This new air defense zone seems to be where the action and party is in the region and any up and coming pilot would not want to miss the chance to strut their stuffs here.

I'm not advocating for war, but is good chance to put into practice all the hard years of training and chance to show who's the top guns in the air and got the better hardware. Hope to see in actual practice how air maneuvers between Flankers vs Eagles are use on the field not just on theory, who would gain the advantage in flight and how each system hardware try to gain advantage for themselves. A lot can be learn here by their military for Japanese on the Chinese air force capabilities and vice versa the Chinese to know whether their modernization is a success.

 

[SinoSoldier]

Yep, you're correct.

The baseline JASDF F-15J is basically a USAF model F-15A. The F-15As do not have ARH BVR capability -- they rely on the AIM-7 SARH missile, which are far less capable than ARH missiles like AIM-120 or PL-12.

Is BVR technically within their reach if they use AWACS, though?

The "upgraded" JASDF F-15J is known as the F-15J "kai" (kai meaning change -- basically "gai" in mandarin lol).
The F-15J Kai are capable of firing ARH BVR missiles in the form of the AAM-4 (which is basically a japanese AMRAAM).
Basically, the F-15J Kai are equivalent in air to air capability to the USAF's F-15Cs (and in turn equivalent to the PLAAF's Su-30MKK/MK2s, and J-11Bs, as well as some older upgarded Su-27SKs)

F-15s are not exactly the best counterpart for comparison with the Su-30MKK, which is more strike-oriented, especially when it comes to weapons integration and avionics. Japanese F-15 upgrades should be comparable to the J-11A and not quite on the same level as the J-11B yet.

However, only a small fraction of JASDF's 213 F-15Js seem to be upgraded to the "kai" standard (although I'm not super sure about the specific number that have been upgarded).


The JASDF's F-15Js are definitely behind compared to USAF F-15s. For one, I don't think the USAF have any F-15As in service anymore. Also, I think the USAF have started to equip their F-15Cs with AESA retrofits.
Compare this to the JASDF's F-15Js where the majority are still not ARH/BVR capable.


To get a handle on the JASDF's average F-15J age, check out this picture of an F-15J cockpit

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Does their lack in quantity of the upgraded F-15 matter in small-scale situations in the ADZ, especially when ground support and tight territory hinders most large-scale incidents?

 

[Blitzo]

Is BVR technically within their reach if they use AWACS, though?

The AIM-7 is already a a BVR missile, the disadvantage is that it is SARH.

I'm not sure how AWACS would help in either situation.

F-15s are not exactly the best counterpart for comparison with the Su-30MKK, which is more strike-oriented, especially when it comes to weapons integration and avionics. Japanese F-15 upgrades should be comparable to the J-11A and not quite on the same level as the J-11B yet.

For the purposes of this comparison they can be more or less amalgamated to the same level. Certainly once you factor in AEWC for both sides, the individual advantages of one incremental spec over another isn't going to matter that much.
Although I maintain that ARH missiles are still a big advantage over SARH missiles.

Does their lack in quantity of the upgraded F-15 matter in small-scale situations in the ADZ, especially when ground support and tight territory hinders most large-scale incidents?

I'm not sure what you mean.

 

[i.e.]

Wind Rises is somehow anti-war and left-wingish, if we are looking for a well-produced patriotic militarism propaganda about IJN warbirds, The Eternal Zero would be a better choice.

Anyway, China had already made 《冲天飞豹(Fight Bomb, 1999)》 and 《歼十出击(Sky Fighters J-10, 2011)》, but they are horrible...
Personally, I think 《长空比翼(A Pilot,1958)》 is the best Air Force Chinese movie so far...
View attachment 9207

OT

Those PLA movies are disgusting.


"Wind Rises" is actually a very good movie where its maker try to deliver a message that Japan CAN break and denounce its ugly and militarist past while same time honor the personal sacrifice and achievement of its people of that era .... WITH OUT resorting to resurrection of its ugly demons.

 

[Blackstone]

Michael Swaine (Asia Studies, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace) has a new article on the ECS ADIZ, from China's perspective. Whether one agrees, disagrees, or a bit of both, it's a well written piece and a good read.

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The article has too many pages to copy-paste, but here are some of his concluding remarks:

Overall, our examination of Chinese views toward the ECS ADIZ indicates that while
both authoritative and non-authoritative Chinese sources argue consistently and often
emphatically that the zone is intended to strengthen safety and preserve stability and is
not directed at any particular country or target, in fact the vague language used to
describe the zone as well as the extensive (and often hostile) attention to Japan paid by
many Chinese sources suggests that such assertions are incorrect and disingenuous at
best. While Beijing has every right to establish an ADIZ in the East China Sea and
elsewhere along its territorial borders, it also has the responsibility to define as clearly
and honestly as possible the operation and intended impact of any such zone. In this
instance, the timing of China’s announcement, during a period of already high tensions
with Tokyo, along with the failure to clearly reassure other nations regarding the manner
in which Beijing will enforce the zone, have undoubtedly undermined the purported
intention of the zone and arguably damaged Beijing’s larger strategic interests in
improving its relationship with other nations in the Asia-Pacific region. This entire
episode suggests that Beijing’s management of at least some highly sensitive foreign
national security issues is dangerously unsophisticated.