Video: Why a strong military is of the utmost importance to China

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Scientific methods have nothing to do with you. So how is it harder for you to show this study? Where's the link? How about anything other than your notorious uncredible word? Just like you to not be able to defend your arguments.
 

solarz

Brigadier
The offical was merely doing her job on the immigration restriction act 1901 restricting non whites into Australia. There was an oportunity to see this put aside if the resident Chinese population were prepared to volunteer at the start of WW2. We didnt take it. and i think we had conciously decided to let the negative sentiments against our deciscion to dilute over time.
I believe a similar type of negativity was displayed towards the Chinese in Indonesia by the indigenous poulation, when they opposed fighting for indepence from the Dutch.

LOL, you just proved Schumacher's point for him.
 

Kurt

Junior Member
Going to war for a country means fighting for the society and institutions of that country or being a mercenary due to economic conditions. If a population is wealthy enough to choose not to be mercenaries they must have a grief with the society and institutions. So what is the conflict between the Chinese immigrants and NZ society/authorities or do these Chinese like for example the quakers have a believe in non-violence?
 

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
LOL, you just proved Schumacher's point for him.

Schmacher's analogy is wrong as he lacks the complete picture of me or my circumstances. Its for similar reasons that I refrain from suggesting that, the Chinese who refrain from criticising their government, are displaying traits of the abused housewife or partner syndrome.

How can a few hundred chinese Chinese voices in NZ make Australia remove the Immigration restriction act?. It needed world opinion and the growing industrial might of Japan to force their hand.
Therefore the decision to swallow the bitter pill and bide ones time was the correct one.
 
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Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Schmacher's analogy is wrong as he lacks a complete picture of me or my circumstances. Its for similar reasons that I refrain from suggesting that, the Chinese who refrain from criticising their government, are displaying traits of the abused housewife or partner syndrome

Lol wut? Overseas chinese criticise the government when it makes sense to, but what you may perceive to be "refraining" from criticising the CCP is more due to overcriticism and BS from everything we see in the west towards china. So most of the time we're defending china instead of being given the air to criticise without political motivations. That's another factor; now most china critics (or any critics at all I suppose) are not really doing it out of constructive desire but just to knock them and let off cheapshots to cater to the western crowd.
You can call it "seeing too much BS" syndrome.

Not sure how what you described can be compared to the battered partner syndrome or whatever it's actually called... But clarify your analogy if you wish.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Typical arrogance. So the only way they see there is legitimate criticism of China is via the West. How does criticizing China through a Westerner do anything? It does nothing. How does telling Westerners establish rights in China? They actually want a show of self-hatred. That's its only purpose. What they actually are saying Chinese people are only allowed to think and perpetuate the agenda of the West. Because they don't arrogantly see this criticism themselves, it means it must not happen. They must also believe if a tree falls in the woods and they're not there, it doesn't make a sound. Everything revolves around them. Surprised?
 
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bladerunner

Banned Idiot
. So what is the conflict between the Chinese immigrants and NZ society/authorities or do these Chinese like for example the quakers have a believe in non-violence?

Nothing like that. . I think its because, people of Anglo Saxon origin were classified as "settlers" the chinese were classified even up to as late as the 50's as "Sojurners" and even then many still saw China as home. While growing up I often heard the phrase ‘the leaves fall (return) to the roots.’ So essentially with the exception of one person and the entry of Japan into the war, they didnt regard it as their fight.

P.S.The Chinese population reached its height in NZ at about 5000 in the later quater of the 19th century after that it was a slow decline till by the start of the war 3000 would have been the most. That included women of several hundred and the children of chinese men cohabiting with Maori women.
 
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bladerunner

Banned Idiot
Not sure how what you described can be compared to the battered partner syndrome or whatever it's actually called... But clarify your analogy if you wish.

Its ok I think youve got the gist on what I was saying.
The analogy accusing me of "brown nosing with tormenters (whites)to gain acceptance , is made by someone , who doesn't no the big picture.
There were more important issues to fight for. Requiring visas to travel to Australia was no big deal even if it was feasible, which it wasnt, I think it was more of an issue often bought up by later day academic types, or a visiting Chinese who may have been inconvenienced to show more persecution of the chinese by the whites.

As I explained to Kurt , the Chinese were classified as "sojurners" not settlers, and it was more important to see that classification removed. Futhermore we were petioning for family unification so those single men who were seperated from their wives because of the poll tax were allowed to bring their families out. This was granted in due course. However the CCP would not allow the family members in China to come out.

I will always remember there was this oldish man who lived in a boarding house.He suffered from some old age memory problem, not Alzheimers i dont think but his memory or or short term memory was bad , but he could remember things way back. He had applied to bring his wife out, and in anticipation of seeing her he had brought out all the things he had purchased for her decades earlier. A few western dresses, perfume stockings and the stuff young ladies would like.he lived in a boarding house and his bedroom was full of these gifts for his wife ( I think he was trying to bring his wife out decades earlier). My dad and Ihad to go round and tell him his wife would not be coming because the CCP said no. He died a week or so later, heartbreak some said, but I blame the CCCP.
 

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
Got proof this or is this just another one of your made up figures like with Chinese chicken exports to the US? And don't give hear-say as proof. I want to see the this study that says this and it better have used the appropriate scientific techniques.

Well You cant acuse me of not trying.

She wasnt forthcoming with the said study but notice when she slapped me down on my interpretation she did not dispute the 95% and only figure I was quoting. And that was at the heart of what you are questioning.? or wanted


RE: Newspaper Article--sorry nothing to do with 'loyalty' to any govt!
Inbox x

Manying Ip [email protected]
12:30 AM (12 hours ago)


to me


Dear

I'm afraid that the interpretation you gave below is incorrect.

My research has nothing to do with 'loyalty to motherland' at all. It is a study of the sense of migrant identity.
If someone identifies with 'being Chinese', it is a sense of cultural belonging, and has no political connotation of 'loyalty' or 'patriotism' towards any government. I'm sorry to diasppoint you.

Unfortunately, many people tend to be rather inventive, and add whatever they like into purely academic findings. I am sure you can easily find many of my research papers, if you just google my name. They are widely available online.

Regards

Manying
________________________________________
From:
Sent: 26 February 2012 18:35
To: Manying Ip
Subject: Newspaper Article

Dear Professor Manying Ip

A recent article in the Auckland Herald attributes the finding that 95% of Chinese immigrants to NZ maintain strong sentiments in the form of loyalty to their motherland. Unless im mistaken the article attributes this finding to one of your studies/publications. If so, can you advise me where/how I can get access to the study in all its entirety. I am not a university student so I expect access to research material could be limited.

Thankyou very very much in anticipation for your help.

Yours sincerely


THerefore you will just have to put up with a crappy newspaper interpretation study where the word loyalty is used by the participants

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Migrants' hearts remain in China, study finds
By Lincoln Tan
5:30 AM Tuesday Feb 7, 2012
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Permanent resident Cherry Li came here in 2002, but says her loyalty would be with China if she had to choose. Photo / Sarah Ivey


China's emergence as a world power is resulting in more Chinese New Zealanders feeling a greater sense of attachment to China than to New Zealand, a study has found.

More than 94 per cent of Chinese permanent residents and more than half of those with NZ citizenship told University of Auckland researchers that they felt a greater sense of belonging and identified more with their country of origin than New Zealand.

Between 2009 and last year, the researchers interviewed 90 migrants originally from China, Hong Kong and Taiwan.

"An overwhelming 94.5 per cent stated they were Chinese/Taiwanese/Hong Konger, while only 5.5 per cent said they somehow felt they belonged to both New Zealand and their country of origin," the report said.

The study also found that Chinese migrants aged 15 to 44 felt significantly more attached to their homeland identity than those aged 45 and over.

Manying Ip, the professor of Asian studies who led the project, described this as "surprising" and said the finding contradicted earlier assumptions that older Chinese migrants were more conservative and therefore felt more attached to their homelands.


"The finding is surprising in that it contravenes accepted migration and acculturation theories," she said.

"It indicates that the younger cohort are more attached than their older counterparts to their native homeland and feel their identity is more Chinese than anything else."

Professor Ip said the finding carried "significant implications for future interpretation of migrants' sense of allegiance and their acculturation process".

"China's rising status as an emergent world power would likely impress young patriotic Chinese much more than older counterparts, who may have had negative first-hand experiences [of] the People's Republic."

The study also found Chinese who first came here as students felt more attached to the country, only 44 per cent of those with New Zealand degrees claiming homeland identity.

Those with a local degree were also more likely to stay. Chinese national Cherry Li, 27, who first came to NZ as an international student in 2002 and now has permanent residency, said "family ties" were a key reason she still felt more Chinese than Kiwi.

"I feel very strongly for New Zealand, but China is still home for me and where my parents and other family members are," she said.

"If there is ever a conflict ... and I have to choose one country, I will still go for China as I am Chinese."

Ms Li, a marketing executive, said she was reluctant to become a New Zealand citizen as it would mean giving up her Chinese passport because China, unlike Taiwan and Hong Kong, does not recognise dual citizenship.

Local-born Chinese community leader Kai Luey said negative attitudes towards Chinese by "mainstream society" made it difficult for many Chinese migrants to feel a total sense of belonging in their adopted homeland.

"Feeling accepted isn't just about attending lantern festivals or eating Chinese food, you got to also accept them as desirable neighbours and employees ... New Zealand has still got this little Britain in the South Pacific syndrome."

By Lincoln Tan | Email Lincoln


So as I said to you earlier , if you wanted the original study, maybe "Blito" could have obtained one. then again how are you gonna put a study which may be anything from a12pages to 100+ on this forum?
 
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bluewater2012

Junior Member
At the start of WW2 there was only one Chinese who fought in the NZ army in Crete/African campaign His name was Alec Wong and a friend of the family. He was born in NZ and would possibly have been conscripted but he chose to volunteer.
The rest of the Chinese males of military age made it quite plain that it wasn't their fight and therefore they weren't interested in volunteering .
To cut the story short all nz troops transited through Australia on their way to the middle east and to facilitate their movement, were given visa waivers including all nationalities who fought on behalf of NZ who weren'.t citizens.
Fast forward to peace time, all these nationalities carried on with their automatic visa free entry to Australia except the Chinese.

I seldom post, but reading this just don't sound right. As least it lack logical reasoning. I mean, okay, so an Chinese male (NZ citizen) volunteered to fight in NZ army in Crete/African campaign vs god know over how many other NZ nationals. And from reading the above those who've fought were given visa waver including all nationalities who fought on behalf of NZ who weren't citizens except the Chinese even though one named Alec Wing -a Chinese descendant had volunteered to fight on the behalf? I mean, how do you define volunteer and how many Chinese do you need versus NZ nationals in order to qualify?

There was this one particular nasty australian in wellington who took particular delight in not processing Chinese visa applications in time for travel.
This attracted the attention of the "maying ip types" who claimed of prejudice etc etc.. Was she right or did the chinese deserve that treatment.

Looks more like prejudices to me, simple as that.
 
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