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asif iqbal

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Much American equipment remains very good

Not in least USS Safeguard ARS-25 which today is on active service with the Turkish navy as a rescue and salvage ship

It was handed over to Turkey in 1987 and do we know when it was commissioned? When the Nazis were still in power during WWII in 1944!!!! By the time it is served the Turkish navy in 2015 when it's due to be replaced by the new indigenous MOSHIP and RATSHIPs it will have served more than 71 years in service

The Sons of the people who have built this ship would be retired pensioners by now
 
TerraN_EmpirE

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Brat thats your opinion and you are welcome to it mind is we can do a lot better. This is the third such program in the last twenty years so I think the argument can be made that I am not alone. Their are limits to the changes and modular capablitys of the M4system say for trying to use it as a PDW. The Army had to doctor the numbers in its defence when compared to other systems in reliability.

By the way this was part of a two prong program the other program? IMPROVED CARBINE Develop a retrofit for M4A1 that adds a piston system, new rail system, bolt, and trigger pack. Basicly a new carbine. By killing this prong the Army is basicly cheating by building in house and not allowing any comparison to other systems for a role that in reality is best served by evaluation.

Final note HK416 and Remington ACR are both using features from Stoner. They both use his AR18 as the point of origin for their gas systems. 416 is in someways HK praying at Stoners alter. It looks like a M4 uses a lot of AR based design but is not backwards compatible. Well ACR is an attempt to keep the best of the AR and loose the worst ACR uses a lot of parts taken from the AR and is more modular. I like to think of both as evolutionary steps for the AR.
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
kwaigonegin said:
Wow! After listening to the audio I am surprised at the total miscommunication between the CO and OOD and the boatswain's mate!!!

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Damn...he wasn't even close to making it across the second tanker's bow...not even close.


USS-Porter-01.jpg


USS-Porter-02.jpg


USS-Porter-03.jpg

​

If he'd gone to flank early on, he probably would have cleared the 2nd tanker...and it is clear that he was advised to do so...but he hesitated far too long, saying, "Let's hold off on going to flank."

He's been relieved...and punished, The commanding officer, Cmdr. Martin F. Arriola was punished by Rear Adm. David M. Thomas, Jr. at Admiral’s Mast following an investigation. The Admiral’s Mast found Arriola in violation of Uniform Code of Military Justice articles 92 (Dereliction of Duty) and 110 (Hazarding a Vessel). Arriola received a punitive letter of reprimand for his actions. He's on shore duty now and will clearly never drive a ship again.

Amazingly, no one was injured or killed.
 
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kwaigonegin

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Jeff Head said:
Damn...he wasn't even close to making it across the second tanker's bow...not even close.


USS-Porter-01.jpg


USS-Porter-02.jpg


USS-Porter-03.jpg

​

If he'd gone to flank early on, he probably would have cleared the 2nd tanker...and it is clear that he was advised to do so...but he hesitated far too long, saying, "Let's hold off on going to flank."

He's been relieved...and is up for punishment. Amazingly, no one was injured or killed.
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It's going to take a lil bit more than elbow grease and a hammer to rub that dent off.
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
kwaigonegin said:
It's going to take a lil bit more than elbow grease and a hammer to rub that dent off.
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Yep...looks like a new front quater panel on that side. Also got up into the superstructure there.

A pretty expensive oops. But the audio makes it clear that the commander simply was far too indecisive. You can hear it in the other's voice...he was clearly, within command protocol, trying to get the commander to ACT, and act much quicker. But he didn't, and this was the price.
 
kwaigonegin

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Jeff Head said:
Yep...looks like a new front quater panel on that side. Also got up into the superstructure there.

A pretty expensive oops. But the audio makes it clear that the commander simply was far too indecisive. You can hear it in the other's voice...he was clearly, within command protocol, trying to get the commander to ACT, and act much quicker. But he didn't, and this was the price.
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yeah and that's why I was concerned. I know hindsight is always 20/20 and it's easy to be an armchair 'admiral' BUT even with that I am shocked at the utter chaos and lack of communication between the folks at the bridge most notably the Kapitan!

I mean to become a captain of an AB destroyer you have to have attained the highest levels of coolness, calmness and professionalism but I do not see that exhibited by this man or some on the bridge... and this is just 'minor' collision with a tanker.

What if the Porter was under air attack or has a few SS-N-22 coming it's way at Mach 3?
Are they going to poop in their pants and cry or what??
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
kwaigonegin said:
yeah and that's why I was concerned. I know hindsight is always 20/20 and it's easy to be an armchair 'admiral' BUT even with that I am shocked at the utter chaos and lack of communication between the folks at the bridge most notably the Kapitan!

I mean to become a captain of an AB destroyer you have to have attained the highest levels of coolness, calmness and professionalism but I do not see that exhibited by this man or some on the bridge... and this is just 'minor' collision with a tanker.

What if the Porter was under air attack or has a few SS-N-22 coming it's way at Mach 3?
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Well, we have a politically correct environment that has been foisted on the military. They are, in many cases, afraid to take decisive action because eveything will be second guessed by JAGS and REMFs...add to that the entire cultural de-emphasis on manliness in general and this is what you get.

My Dad use to tell me about the early days of World War II. He was a combat officer in the PTO, and we lost a lot of ships and men there, particularly in the first couple of years.

He told me, up until 2004 when he died, that leading up to World War II there was a lot of rear echelon politics in the Navy and a lot of people commanding that were simply not prepared for war. He used to always tell me that it took a couple of years for that situation to be corrected and that, sadly, the way it got washed out was first and foremost by personnle being injured and killed in combat situations where these deficiencies became apparent...and then as time went on, by the new breed of commanders recognizing these issues beforehand and flushing those unsuited for that level of command (in that type of combat), or not allowing them to be in those poitions in the 1st place...where decisive, correct judgement, unfettered by politics could be employed to win battles and not please higher ups.

Seems, sadly, that we may have to relearn those lessons. Part of it is just human nature and the nature of governments that get bloated and are not having to struggle for their very existance.

At the same time, I have those close to me, both in my immediate family and as close friends who are in naval service, and there are a LOT of very good commanders still plowing the seas. There are lots who have been taught, and have blood lines and history extending back many generations who know the score. Every so often something like this comes along though and lets us see that there are some just not prepared for that position...or who are hindered by the "system."
 
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Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
Air Force Brat said:
In the same vein: News Flash!!! DOD has begun the RIF of all MEN in US uniform!!!! in order to prevent any further sexual assaults ALL MEN are being RIFFED from USAF to be replaced by EUNUCHs and WOMEN. OH Yeah, all Eunuchs and Women are being immediately promoted to General and ALL aircraft are being converted to DRONES! NO PILOTS WANTED OR NEEDED! OBAMA and HAGEL say it has worked well for them???? STOP---THAT IS ALL! Brat
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That's right gentlemen, and as Sailors are to the Navy, Pilots are to the Air Force, Combat Soldiers are to the Army, and Jar-Heads are to the Marines, and Seamen are to the Coast-Guard, MEN make up the effective elements of US Combat Forces, MEN who understand their JOB, and let others do theirs. As the Father of Seven daughters, if my little girls where physically and emotionally equipped to take on the job of Combat Pilot, I have NO PROBLEM with that. Also for the Morons who physically or sexually assault members of the opposite sex in the military, they should be HUNG, I think the Judge said "by the NECK until DEAD!
This politically correct promotion of all others just to be fair, is patently and unequivacably dangerous to every Soldier, Sailor, and Airman, and whoever occupies the Left Front Seat of any aircraft military or civilian, or the bridge of a Combat Vessel, better be MAN enough for the job.
Further more, when we place healthy men and women in close proximity to one another, in dangerous or lonely places, they will Bond, just as Combat Troops do, it may not be what the Chess Players desire, but it is a NATURAL process, if you don't want that to happen, you simply do not cause it to happen by placing young women in those positions of vulnerability. TRUST ME, I ain't gonna let the neighbor kid go upstairs to visit the twins, if I catch him up there, he will Die or wish he were Dead!"
On an aircraft carrier, it "might" be workable???? it is not on a attack submarine. Brat

No this is not sexist: it is biology 101, it is life and since the dawn of time Men have led in combat, to operate an Aircraft or Vessel effectively requires the SKILL to do so Competantly and Confidently, to lack those skills will eliminate also rans from the competition, whether in your chain of command or on the field of conflict?? Brat

Further Social Engineering has NO PLACE in the MILITARY, US or otherwise, to argue that, is to place those whom we have entrusted in mortal danger! They deserve much better!
 
kwaigonegin

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Air Force Brat said:
That's right gentlemen, and as Sailors are to the Navy, Pilots are to the Air Force, Combat Soldiers are to the Army, and Jar-Heads are to the Marines, and Seamen are to the Coast-Guard, MEN make up the effective elements of US Combat Forces, MEN who understand their JOB, and let others do theirs. As the Father of Seven daughters, if my little girls where physically and emotionally equipped to take on the job of Combat Pilot, I have NO PROBLEM with that. Also for the Morons who physically or sexually assault members of the opposite sex in the military, they should be HUNG, I think the Judge said "by the NECK until DEAD!
This politically correct promotion of all others just to be fair, is patently and unequivacably dangerous to every Soldier, Sailor, and Airman, and whoever occupies the Left Front Seat of any aircraft military or civilian, or the bridge of a Combat Vessel, better be MAN enough for the job.
Further more, when we place healthy men and women in close proximity to one another, in dangerous or lonely places, they will Bond, just as Combat Troops do, it may not be what the Chess Players desire, but it is a NATURAL process, if you don't want that to happen, you simply do not cause it to happen by placing young women in those positions of vulnerability. TRUST ME, I ain't gonna let the neighbor kid go upstairs to visit the twins, if I catch him up there, he will Die or wish he were Dead!"
On an aircraft carrier, it "might" be workable???? it is not on a attack submarine. Brat

No this is not sexist: it is biology 101, it is life and since the dawn of time Men have led in combat, to operate an Aircraft or Vessel effectively requires the SKILL to do so Competantly and Confidently, to lack those skills will eliminate also rans from the competition, whether in your chain of command or on the field of conflict?? Brat

Further Social Engineering has NO PLACE in the MILITARY, US or otherwise, to argue that, is to place those whom we have entrusted in mortal danger! They deserve much better!
Click to expand...

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This is good article IMHO. If anyone who knows more about women and military it's the IDF. It would behoove the US Armed Forces to learn from them. The problem facing the US military today I think is not knowing the difference between equality and 'sameness'. They are NOT the same no pun intended. You can be equal and different at the same time.

If you treat women as equal BUT yet recognize that they are NOT the same as men then you would go far and have an effective and modern military.

However if you treat women as equal BUT also 'pretend' they are the same then you will have problems like sexual abuse, rapes that is actually rampant in the US Armed Forces today... not to mention ineffective organization because you are crippled by political correctness and other things that comes with it.

I have no problems with women in combat roles BUT let's not pretend than a typical woman can also carry a 100 ibs ALICE on her back either. When you have to make special bunks, rooms, head etc for women you are in effect taking precious room that can otherwise be used more effectively for other things.

If you promote someone based on their gender or race when they are not qualified than you are in effect minimizing or damaging the credibility of your organization. On the flip side when someone do get promoted and they are deserving, one should ALSO recognize it and NOT play the racial card as well.

As an example I think Colin Powell earned his strips and so do folks like Eric Shenseki. They definitely did not get there based on Affirmative Action or any other BS that some fools may pull.

Anyway this is my personal opinion... not trying to sound chauvinistic or start any argument.
 
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