Tibet is a part of China and if you disagree, you'll have to take that one up with your buddies in the KMT.
US Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
- Thread starter tphuang
- Start date
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Is this a thread of news or just trolling? False equivalence, rampant nation bashing, revisionism. I mean HSR to Hyper sonic missiles? What’s next Santa Claus to Mao?
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
To Paraphrase Gordon Ramsey “Finally Some real F…ing posts”
This is the first part of the NGSW and will be the most common part. It’s also the part that is likely to evolve dramatically over the decades of service.
It’s a LPVO with an integrated range finder it will be used on the Rifle and LMG. It’s not going to be cheap at least not initially as it’s a mass production volume component. It’s the part that makes the aim of an effective range out of 800m possible.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
That and the Winchester ammo contract.
Does anyone want half of that shit on their rifle? How much does it all weigh? Seems like XM8 all over again.
Moving to 6.8mm however would be sensible.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
The counter point you want to make is so far away from the one you tried for they might as well be on different planets.
First of that “Shit” as you put it. XM157 NGSW FC as the Army puts it and Vortex Optics 1-8×30 Active Reticle Fire Control as it’s maker puts it.
It’s a 1-8 power veritable optic that means that the soldier can use it as a Close quarters reflex or a long range scope.
it’s got a built in 1km laser range finder. So the soldier can now gage how far away his targets are accurately to a 1000m.
its got a weather sensor so he knows what the wind is doing what the atmospheric conditions are like between him
And the target.
It’s got a ballistic computer in it that combines all that. Which means that at 800m the soldier is going to be able to milk all the accuracy out of his weapon.
It’s a bigger deal than the Rifle or Ammunition as without it the soldier can’t take advantage of the 6.8x51mm’s potential.
So the guy with this will be highly likely able to get first shot hits on his targets in open terrain outside his adversaries effective range. It’s an unfair advantage. The contract is as the system has been in trials. So it’s highly unlikely to not perform as advertised.
How much would it weigh? Total package? The optic is supposed to come in at under 2 pounds. Without the computer and so on the Scope it’s based off is 10 ounces so figure 2 pounds sounds safe. Assuming Sig (probably the most likely winner at this point) Spear that’s about ~8.5~ pounds no ammo no suppressor. The can is maybe 12.7 ounces using a Sig model in 7.62 as basis of comparison so about .75 of a pound total package is probably 11-12 pounds. For the rifle. Some M4A1 kitted out come to that.
The optic though is also for the LMG so about 12 pound Sig LMG plus another pound for the can then the 2 pound optic 15 pounds empty which is about the same weight as an M249 empty.
No Nothing NOTHING like what happened with XM8.
XM8 failed due to a number of reasons, first the Army was running the program outside the normal program management system. PEO soldier weapons started it by breaking the XM29 OICW into two parts the XM25 CDTE and XM8 OICW increment 1. With the initial goal of trying to put them separately on a diet and then down the line getting the weight reduced versions back together. As it progressed some one decided to drop the eventual unification and push them totally as separate programs with the XM8 now as a M4 replacement.
Functionally XM8 wasn’t bad. It was a 5.56x45mm gas operated rifle derivative but not interchangeable with the HK G36. It was a modular rifle with 3 main configurations a 9 inch barreled PDW, 12.5 inch barreled carbine and an 18 inch barreled DMR/Automatic rifle. Where if differs from the G36 is a more streamlined mold, it had an adjustment LOP telescoping stock like M4 and PCAPS. PCAPS was a forerunner of Keymod and MLok a rail less return to zero mounting system. The PCAPS was used to mount a from the factory a zeroed Reflex optic either a Red dot with built in Lasers or a 3x fixed power optic with lasers.
It wasn’t perfect, some claim that the hand guard over heated and melted. The Magazine system was G36 based so the entire US Army would have had to toss the US GI magazine and all its pouches out. PCAPS wasn’t backwards comparable with any then in service accessories which by that point in 2006 was substantial. It was never and wouldn’t have ever been able to achieve its weight goal without changing the 5.56x45mm ammunition system in the US to a polymer case (which lead to the LSAT program after XM8).
XM8’s biggest political headache on the program was that HK hadn’t bid for XM8 it had bid for XM25 with ATK. So the Army was awarding a competition less program to a foreign maker without allowing US firms to bid. PEO soldier had a ton of crow to eat for that. Colt and FNH wouldn’t let that pass. Sig wasn’t the Giant it is today. When PEO soldier weapons was forced to start the system by asking the Ft Benning Infantry school what it needed the response wasn’t not a new rifle but a replacement for the M249.
Yet the Final Nail in XM8’s coffin was, It didn’t offer anything that M4A1 already did. As long as the Rifle was built to a 5.56x45mm NATO spec it’s limited to the performance envelop of that round. The cycle of integration of the XM8 would have cost a lot of monies and resources to offer at best identical performance with no major benefit pay back. If anything it in the long run would have been a step backwards as once the proliferation of night vision systems to the Taliban and other Nonstate actors. The hypothetical M8 rifle would have lacked the ability to counter by easy adoption of improved Night vision systems like the FWS-I.
The only aspect that was saved by the US Army from the XM8 OICW was the XM320 accessory Grenade launcher today the M320A1/A2. It’s failures pushed the US Army to the LSAT program and reduced weight ammo programs. Though they appear to have failed to degrees.
XM8 In some ways Inspired the Magpul Masada which became the Remington ACR. That would lead to the PMAGs and MLok.
It was a partial roadmap for the SCAR program which it competed in. HK used it to improve G36 and It’s part of why the HK416 was brought to market. Small numbers were sold to Malaysian Navy Special forces. It also in a way could be seen as the start of the trend that lead Sig to the MCX and in turn the SPEAR. The requirements from Ft Benning are part of the Draft for the NGSW AR.
I'm curious, these capabilities required and neccesary for the gun, or a suplier just said "guys, I have a sight with wifi, will you buy it ? ".
I mean, all that capability sounds like lot of debuging work on field, and lot of training . Is it worth the effort ?