Ukrainian War Developments

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Laviduce

Junior Member
Registered Member
Then why don’t most Europeans vote themselves out of NATO?
Is this a serious question ? :oops: I do not think the bosses of Europe in Washington DC would be too thrilled if their military block imploded over night because some European beauracrats had the idea to acutally give the sane people of Europe a choice. These things are not up for a vote. Realistically the only nation that gets a vote is the US. The "people" would be asked last if at all. The US infiltrated governments of Europe would have to basically abandon this US military block, which will not happen. Also, Russophobic nutjob countries like Poland et al. welcome NATO.
 

james smith esq

Senior Member
Registered Member
No, sferrin is not an alt of sleepystudent.

He's been present on here, and multiple other forums, for a long time and has an established posting history that long predates sleepy. Just a PSA.
Now, we’re getting paranoid and shooting innocents! The Russians’ have succeeded!!!
 

Abominable

Major
Registered Member
Why do you think there "ought to be none [security threat by Russia]" when Putin repeatedly laments the collapse of Soviet Union as the "the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century"? I don't see any basis where it can credibly asserted that Russia "ought not be" a security concern when it's leader openly waxes about the loss of Soviet territories. I think given the fresh memories of Soviet domination, Putin the Great's desire for glory, it is not unreasonable to seek nuclear weapons or defensive alliances. Some members dismiss Ukraine as merely a 'US puppet' incapable of independent thought, but I think the fresh memories of Soviet domination and Putin's musing about former glory can easily justify joining defensive alliances. Afterall, Russia's weakness is only temporary, not permanent.
The Nazis treated them worse than the Soviets ever did yet they all line up to suckle on Germany's teat. Russia is poor, Germany is rich.

The only reason why eastern Europeans want to be part of NATO is they believe it will speed up EU membership and make them less poor.

Just today the Ukrainian president asked to have their EU application sped up. You're being invaded man, get your priorities straight.
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Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Wishful thinking at best, if what happened to Russia proven anything, then it is certainly proven nothing is off the table when the West decided to gang up against you.
Well, Russia has a GDP smaller than Guangdong, China, so it's a lot easier to cut off SWIFT to an economic minnow than an economic superpower like China.
Both Republicans and Democrats want China dead. If that isn't scary enough, then what worst can it gets for China. Big corporations and Wall St tried to convince Biden not to impose SWIFT on Russia, did Biden listen. These billionaires don't speak in one voice and have different interests. They can't be relied upon when push comes to shove.
Only a select number of banks were kicked off SWIFT, so Germany can still pay Russia for it's gas imports, which satisfied Wall Street, Big Corporations, and Billionaire class of avoiding an European energy crisis rippling throughout the world. These Capitalists are flexible in their Russia- or China-hating ideology when the costs are too high.
 
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