Flankers variants get shot down, not once, but handful of times, should really count as an alarm for the performance of VKS. Especially against an enemy who is not even countering with a fleet of cutting edge US equipment. The people at the top of VKS should really do some deep analysis and reform after this war.
3 or 4 or shot down? and none at medium to higher altitude otherwise the debris will spread over kms.
. Its primary low altitude war with in visual range strike both in chopper and fighters.
higher altitude losses are not much better.
I am not arguing against Su-34. In fact, I would certainly rank Su-34 above Su-30, especially for a country as big as Russia.
I just think that the Su-34 should be equipped with targeting pod that is more advanced and robust than its current internal electro-optical targeting systems. And I also think VKS should field an ocean of 250kg class GLONASS/INS PGMs, instead of carrying dumb bombs like we are seeing in Russian TV videos.
you only see image of Su-34 either shot down due to low altitude or what Russians is showing. it does not mean that other 200 to 300 sorties are done same way. Orion drone was testing in Syria but years later they showed up its strike sorties. so we cannot exclude they not testing systems of SU-34M and Ka-52M for much longer range strikes.
They might have already been doing so, but really, The longer this war drags on, so much that even the brits can get anti-ship missiles to Odessa, should really be a wake up call for VKS to ramp up their game.
i doubt few antiship missiles can change anything. Russia train with high end war. thats why they cannot see how rockets or drone attack a cargo ship.
Dude! Cost, efficiency.
How many assembly plants does the US has for F-35? The US produces more F-35's than Russia produces flanker versions, every year. Yet the US has only one assembly plant for F-35.
F-35 is think produced in Texas with global supply chain. not exactly ideal place for manufacturing when they have to compete with Elon Musk and so many other factories for skill labor and whole tranport expenses moving in and out stuff.
Flanker variants are produced in stand alone aviation towns with no competition from Elon or high price MBAs in the area. They are now producing Drones and Civil Aviation products in same locations. It is far more efficient when labor turnover is low and skill level dedicated to Aviation. If Russians cannot managed efficiently they will not have overhaul business in Gulf. they know how to manage.
Do you really think this model of having two or three different plant producing essentially different variants of the same airframe, each with different major subsystems (radar, engine), and ONLY with a handful order each year per each variant is a good manufacturing model?!?!
It looks like Su-35, Su-34, Su-30SM are the three currently produced models for Russian Air force. My question will be why these three all have different engines and radars?
single seat and twin seat strike platform the same? twin seat platform may get more data from Drones/AWACS/JSTAR to have clear picture of much more targets on ground or sea.
while Single seat fighter mostly dealing with air targets with secondary role in strike. this create more proficient air force.
Well, at least from the trend of things, it looks like Russia is already moving towards more shared components and less platform variants. The VKS stopped purchasing Su-30M2 for quite a few years already, it seems. There is also the KAB-250 family proliferating. And the Su-30SM2 project of getting Su-30SM to the level of Su-35.
SU-30M replaced by Su-35 in same factory. Su-30SM is separate.
If Russia can eventually make Su-35 and Su-30SM with the same major components (engine, avionics). They simply become a single-seat, double-seat combo.
And Su-34 is kept as the long-range long-endurance tactical bomber with fighter DNA.
This would be a good thing to see in the future.
They have orders for Su-34M and S-70 built in same location.. i would think Su-30SM will moveout of production once MS21 is in mass production. Su-35 production will get replaced by Su-57/SU-75 as they in same factory.
I still hold the suspicion that the Russia strategic doctrine towards procurement is flawed and lacking in foresight. This is causing them valuable time and resources. And resulted in this current situation where Russia has all these repetitive PPT "newest cutting edge programs", but perpetually in the development phase, with no meaningfully large enough procurement to allow Russian VKS to have the fists to punch.
well they have more than 300 Su-34/Su-30. and now add upto 200 Su-25SM. this very big force.
Su-25SM3 survival rate very good and most effective aircraft for mobile targets. Ukraine hardly has armour formations. so only Su-25 can deal with it effectively.
It's like they have the technology, they can make those equipment, and they have new stuff in the testing, but they simple don't have enough working systems in actual service in the VKS.
why you think so many in testing. they dont need single engine fighter or another turbo prop drone.
now they do need this one not for AAMs but huge sensor power and higher altitude than AWACS.
