Ukrainian War Developments

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Anlsvrthng

Captain
Registered Member
I'm not sure whether it's Zelensky's policy to fight to the last Ukrainian or Biden's. It could be both as well.

This being an American plan to punish Russia doesn't make correlate with the fact that they've spent the last 4 years putting China in the crosshairs. It doesn't make sense to do that and then suddenly turn around and beg Xi for help to stop the Russians. I'm sure all the economic and information warfare being deployed right now were planned to be used against China. It wasn't long ago people were using the term "Xitler". Why show your hand now and waste that on Russia?

At some point one of them will find the losses to be too much to stomach. Being a Ukrainian you'd think it would be Zelensky. If he does, his people will hate him.
Most likelly he has to fullfil the conditions for the USA passport and money.

Full inlfexibility when the citizens in your die pointing to this direction.

Millions of refuges, economy destroyed, and industry/buildings bombed and burning, and this is the smaller problem compared to the piling up corpses.


If he care then try everything in his power to stop the war.
 

Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
Yeah, diabolical and subversive isn't it that most NATO members have such small armies when clearly the organization is hell-bent on aggressively conquering the world and Russia in particular ;)
No, they are NOT. lol

NATO is the opposite. NATO is the bandwagon to hop on, so that you as a relatively small/weak country DON'T have to pay your fair share of defense spending that you will need to pay alone, and get the benefit of being able to scare off much much larger and more powerful potential adversaries.

Therefore, the biggest problem of NATO is precisely that it's own purpose and "selling-point" are the things that will burden it and making it impossible to sustain. Because defense budget NOT SPENT will be spent on other important things like welfare, development, education, trade, etc. Nations in NATO actually got their overall comparative margin of competitiveness (in human development, research, standard of living, etc) over other NON-allied countries precisely because they can afford to pay much less on defense individually, and be able to use these money to further their advantage in other fields. Now that they have to pay more for defense, they will have to spend these money much much more wisely in order to offset the decrease of funding for many other fields/uses.

If NATO got tricked by Russia into spending more on defense specifically against a potential aggression that is not going to happen, that will be as stupid as the French spending billions building the Maginot Line. Then, Russia would have benefited.

So far, none of the countries who are supposedly going to increase their defense budget are actually spending that money wisely. Of course, there are no way they can spend those money meaningfully. Building a few hundred/thousand tanks and IFVs is a waste of money for NATO countries in EU, because it does NOT give them any new strategic capabilities that has the ability to strategically threaten Russia in a new way. These can ONLY make a hypothetical Russian Invasion of European members of NATO more costly and more difficult. If Russia does NOT plan on invading but have other plans to make strategic gains, the money spent on these would have no other way of countering those, nor have these any ability to threaten Russia.

If European members of NATO want to increase spending to offset "Russian Aggression" and spend those money wisely, they will need to form a "European Center" and allocate all its European member's increased spending together in one pool. And using these together on projects that will gain new strategic capabilities. For example: hypersonic missiles, stealth bombers, heavy 5-gen/6-gen multirole fighters, SSNs, heavy strategic airlifts, etc. We all know this is impossible.
 
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james smith esq

Senior Member
Registered Member
No, they are NOT. lol

NATO is the opposite. NATO is the bandwagon to hop on, so that you as a relatively small/weak country DON'T have to pay your fair share of defense spending that you will need to pay alone, and get the benefit of being able to scare off much much larger and more powerful potential adversaries.

Therefore, the biggest problem of NATO is precisely that it's own purpose and "selling-point" are the things that will burden it and making it impossible to sustain. Because defense budget NOT SPENT will be spent on other important things like welfare, development, education, trade, etc. Nations in NATO actually got their overall comparative margin of competitiveness (in human development, research, standard of living, etc) over other NON-allied countries precisely because they can afford to pay much less on defense individually, and be able to use these money to further their advantage in other fields. Now that they have to pay more for defense, they will have to spend these money much much more wisely in order to offset the decrease of funding for many other fields/uses.

If NATO got tricked by Russia into spending more on defense specifically against a potential aggression that is not going to happen, that will be as stupid as the French spending billions building the Maginot Line. Then, Russia would have benefited.

So far, none of the countries who are supposedly going to increase their defense budget are actually spending that money wisely. Of course, there are no way they can spend those money meaningfully. Building a few hundred/thousand tanks and IFVs is a waste of money for NATO countries in EU, because it does NOT give them any new strategic capabilities that has the ability to strategically threaten Russia in a new way. These can ONLY make a hypothetical Russian Invasion of European members of NATO more costly and more difficult. If Russia does NOT plan on invading but have other plans to make strategic gains, the money spent on these would have no other way of countering those, nor have these any ability to threaten Russia.

If European members of NATO want to increase spending to offset "Russian Aggression" and spend those money wisely, they will need to form a "European Center" and allocate all its European member's increased spending together in one pool. And using these together on projects that will gain new strategic capabilities. For example: hypersonic missiles, stealth bombers, heavy 5-gen/6-gen multirole fighters, SSNs, heavy strategic airlifts, etc. We all know this is impossible.

Only bring-up the Maginot Line if you no longer want to have French friends! I do it all the time!!! :)

Ask any Frenchman if the root word of Maginot is imaginary!
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Here's a story on why they would give people who don't know what they're taking about a public voice. It's because they're a victim. And not because they're victims of the Ukrainian War. It's because they're a victim because a guy's wife was killed on a movie set. I'm talking about the incident involving actor Alec Baldwin. The cinematographer on set who was accidentally shot and killed was Ukrainian. Her American husband is trying to get his wife's parents out of the country and because the US and NATO aren't imposing a no-fly zone, he's demanding China place a no-fly zone over Ukraine. Are they going to bother to correct him on how China can't impose a no-fly zone even if they wanted to do it? In the Western victim culture, you don't dare do that with people who are in fragile states like children who can't handle the truth so the parents protect them by lying to them like how the US and NATO would prevent that from happening in the first place.
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
There is a difference between bending to western pressure and digging a bigger hole for yourself by being associated with an international pariah. I don't think it's too much to ask for china to not send military support to Russia during the conflict and to not export stuff with us parts to Russia. Just do those two things and nobody outside of china hawks can really give you a hard time.
 

Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
Here's a story on why they would give people who don't know what they're taking about a public voice. It's because they're a victim. And not because they're victims of the Ukrainian War. It's because they're a victim because a guy's wife was killed on a movie set. I'm talking about the incident involving actor Alec Baldwin. The cinematographer on set who was accidentally shot and killed was Ukrainian. Her American husband is trying to get his wife's parents out of the country and because the US and NATO aren't imposing a no-fly zone, he's demanding China place a no-fly zone over Ukraine. Are they going to bother to correct him on how China can't impose a no-fly zone even if they wanted to do it? In the Western victim culture, you don't dare do that with people who are in fragile states like children who can't handle the truth so the parents protect them by lying to them like how the US and NATO would prevent that from happening in the first place.
You mean like:
JackNicholson.jpg

Gee, that's a shocker.
 

nixdorf

New Member
Registered Member
View attachment 85423



As of mid-2021, the Russians have 339 operational nuclear-armed ICBMs and the US has 400 operational nuclear-armed ICBMs. None of the US ICBMs are MIRVed (and therefore contain only 1 warhead), while hundreds of Russian ICBMs are MIRVed, all with warheads (~20x RS-18 with 6 MIRV warheads, 46x RS-20 with 10 MIRV warheads, ~99x RS-24 Yars with ~3 MIRV warheads, ~18x RS-24 Yars with ~3 MIRV warheads, and ~54x Yars-S with ~3 MIRV warheads).

That's 1,195 nuclear warheads on its ICBMs for Russia (1093 MIRVed and 102 unitary) while the US has only 400 unitary warheads on each ICBM.

Clear numerical superiority. All of those ICBMs have the ability to hit anywhere within the US (same with the US against Russia) so there's nothing inferior there either. They also average noticeably higher nuclear yields than the US. Note I only included operational warheads, not any experimental stuff the Russians are producing.

In terms of nuclear-armed strategic aircraft, the Russians have 76 nuclear-armed strategic aircraft (9 Tu-160; 7 Tu-160 mod; 42 Tu-95MS; 18 Tu-95MS mod) and the US has 66 (20 B-2A; 46 B-52H). The US has ~528 AGM-86B ALCMs with a range of 1500+ miles to arm their 66 bombers, the Russians have ~600 nuclear-armed KH-55SM and KH-102 ALCMs, with published ranges of ~1800 miles and ~2,800 miles, respectively.

Once again, no clear inferiority, in either numbers, range or magnitude. You can take as many grains of salt as you like, in regards to the published ranges being fake, or the inventory being pumped, or even frauding the warhead yield. You can assume their maintenance is so garbage that many of the warheads will fail to work or the missiles will implode before they even leave Russia. All this still would leave Russia in the ballpark of total US nuclear strategic capability.

The last area, SLBMs on SSBNs, is the place where the US has superiority. 14 Ohio with up to 20 UGM-133A Trident D-5/D-5LE nuclear SLBMs each (280 SLBMs max) all with MIRV capability of up to 14 warheads. On average though, each missile only carries ~4 warheads (due to treaty limitations). That is ~1,120 warheads. The Russians have 11 SSBNs (1 Kalmar; 6 Delfin; 3 Borey; 1 Borey-A) with 16 SLBMs each (of varying types) for a total of 176 SLBMs and a total average warhead count of ~816 warheads (slightly higher MIRV warhead count than the US). Range for the US and Russia is not very relevant, the worst SLBM (with Russia) can hit Florida just 500 miles north of central Siberia.

As you can see, nuclear war is one area the US can't win. US population density is also vastly higher, land area in overall size is much more limited, and urbanization is higher as well. A nuclear war with Russia would end for all time the US, but would not end Russia despite crippling it for many decades (assuming climate catastrophe from a nuclear winter is overhyped, which it certainly is).
Russia has no stealth bomber nor bases for them sitting along American borders
 
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