Type 022 Missile Boat

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

Gollevainen said:

, something that will keep chinese shores safe before PLAN can be that strong that no one even gets missile range of mainland....

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Any ship launched from Taiwan, South Korea, or Vietnam starts out being within missile range. Even Japan comes pretty close. Then of course there are U.S. aircraft carriers.

You have to figure at least 50 years before China can feel confident that none of these would get within missile range of the mainland, making the 22s a really long stopgap if you look at it that way.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

Well it may not need 50 years...30-40 perhaps...:china:

Well my idea is a bit more cynical. Every service has contentions of doctrines. People with certain ideas compete with other people with different ideas. In some navies for examples, there are always the gulls (the pro carrier faction) and the dolphins (the sub faction). That seems to be true of the PLAN.

My theory is that this is probably the brainchild of a younger officer, looking for a naval equivalent of an "assassin's mace". I find the entire concept and its execution to be very high tech for a mere coastal defence. And even if you plan a reserve coastal defense force, you would probably think that a more conventional FAC with organic sensors can better accomplish that purpose. Somehow some person may have managed to market the idea well to the PLAN and higher ups to get this much resources to execute.

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Could be. To mee it still reflects some type of "play safe" type of mentality of PLAN. It has only recentyl strated to adopt methods which were introduced other places much earlier. For some cases it seems that the chinese feel like walking on thin ice and they think really hard for each step. Perhaps in the coastal defence sector which most likely has set little bit behind for the changes they are thinking of doing it "like its done sofar" tough with little touch of makeup...Or that the recourses and capacity of the chinese fleet modernisation cannot transform all the branches of the fleet from few generations upwards in single night and thus the development is focused on the main weaknesses. The coastal defence anti-ship role just got new clothes, the dude wearing them is still the same...

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

I don't see anything "safe" about the Houbei concept and strategy. Its more of an all out risk and gamble, with little or no fall back. It's entirely dependent on the network to work and so puts a trust on the system, which previous PLAN doctrine would not. For that matter, I don't really see a similar extreme case at all with any Western navy. Its similar to the sea denial approach of the Soviet Navy in concept and execution but with much more modern technologies.

I don't see the Chinese coast need any reserve defending at all. There is more than enough of the old ships that have been upgraded packing YJ-8X missiles, plus shore based units with AshMs, not to mention a rather large naval air arm and a big air force that includes bombers and strikers by the hundreds.

The Houbei is not a reserve coastal defense ship. Its an assassin's mace. Simple as that.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

type 22 will act as major strike force in the green water around china, namely south china sea and east china sea, and by working in conjunction with Y-8 etc, it can pose a serious especially in the south china sea against far weaker navies. by the way is there any possibilities for JH-7A do direct the missiles on type 22?

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

Hand off, probably not. By hand off I mean the control of the missile fired from the 022 is given to the JH-7A. I would think however, that the obvious is much more possible, which is the JH-7A giving search and tracking target information to the 022, which can then guide the missile in mid phase towards the target area.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

crobato said:

Hand off, probably not. By hand off I mean the control of the missile fired from the 022 is given to the JH-7A. I would think however, that the obvious is much more possible, which is the JH-7A giving search and tracking target information to the 022, which can then guide the missile in mid phase towards the target area.

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sorry, yea that what i meant, for JH-7A to acquire the target and pass it to 022s, i.e JH-7A acts like Y8, also can 039 pass information in this regard? since they can also firing yjs

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

I don't see anything "safe" about the Houbei concept and strategy. Its more of an all out risk and gamble, with little or no fall back. It's entirely dependent on the network to work and so puts a trust on the system, which previous PLAN doctrine would not. For that matter, I don't really see a similar extreme case at all with any Western navy. Its similar to the sea denial approach of the Soviet Navy in concept and execution but with much more modern technologies.

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well the safe part comes from the fact that the operational philosophy fits well into the existing command structure and to the stiff organisational hierarchy that PLAN still fields with its sea going units. The new innovatives in target accustion and weapon systems present's only change in the intial tactical envelope of these vessels, but the overal coastal defence strategy of PLAN still remains the same as it has been.
In future, when PLAN dominates the oceans around its shores, such force would not be needed anymore, and My estimations are that when these crafts service life comes to end, PLAN is reached that level.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

sinowarrior said:

sorry, yea that what i meant, for JH-7A to acquire the target and pass it to 022s, i.e JH-7A acts like Y8, also can 039 pass information in this regard? since they can also firing yjs

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I heard that there is some kind of underwater communications,but that is done by the larger vessels to the subs. I don't think the JH-7A can communicate to the 039 directly and vice versa. It has to pass through a ship or to an underwater network.

The 1994 incident with the Han reveals the PLAN has an effective submarine and satellite communications. In this incident, a Han sub trailed the USS Kitty Hawk, which responded by calling the ASW escorts to harass the sub. Without the sub surfacing, two J-6s flew straight out from their base to buzz the escorts. Somehow, the sub managed to communicate back to base, something is able to vector the J-6s to that same location.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

sinowarrior said:

type 22 will act as major strike force in the green water around china, namely south china sea and east china sea, and by working in conjunction with Y-8 etc, it can pose a serious especially in the south china sea against far weaker navies. by the way is there any possibilities for JH-7A do direct the missiles on type 22?

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Aren't there land based installations that can act as the guidance for the 022s? Wasn't there a few installations out in the South China Sea, the Spratlys, etc? Then you add the Y-8s, the bigger ships, and maybe an unbuilt mother ship and you've got enough systems for a group of 022s to do their job.

Re: Missiles for 2208 catamaran FAC

Two homogeneous configurations:

4x2 YJ-83



or

1X2 YJ-12



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