The War in the Ukraine

baykalov

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The article does not paint a pretty picture. Is Ukraine capable of competent combined arms operations?!

The article addresses a lot of the issues regarding the training and command structure of Ukrainian armed forces. There are some suggestions on how to improve things in the article.

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baykalov

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Since Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022 it has caused enormous damage. Thousands of people have died and billions of dollars’ worth of infrastructure has been destroyed in Ukraine. Yet all this damage has come at a relatively mild cost to Russia. As we have reported, its economy is holding up much better than almost anyone expected. And the direct fiscal cost of the war—what it is spending on men and machines—is surprisingly low.

Russia’s budget is murky—especially its military one. So our estimate of what Russia is spending on invading Ukraine is imprecise. However, in consultation with various experts, and using our own analysis, we have come up with a figure. In essence this involved taking the Russian government’s pre-invasion forecast of what it would spend on defence and security, and comparing that with what it is actually spending. That would put the cost of its invasion at 5trn roubles ($67bn) a year, or 3% of GDP.

That is, by historical standards, a puny amount. We compiled estimates of spending on other wars—some involving Russia, some not (see chart). At the peak of the second world war the USSR spent 61% of GDP on the war effort. Around the same time America spent about 50% of GDP on its military forces.

Three reasons explain why Russia is spending so little. The first is political. Many within the Russian government would like to continue to portray the war on Ukraine as a “special military operation”. It would hardly make sense for such an operation to cost a double-digit percentage of GDP.

The second is economic. Russia would struggle to expand the war effort without costing its citizens dearly: printing money would spur inflation, eroding living standards; loading up banks with public debt might have a similar effect; tax rises or a big shift in public expenditure towards defence would also eat into personal incomes. This is a problem for Vladimir Putin, who has presidential elections in 2024. Mr Putin’s victory seems certain, but he does not want the potential embarrassment of large demonstrations, as happened for example in legislative elections in 2011. “Of course, national defence is the top priority,” he said recently, “but in resolving strategic tasks in this area, we should not repeat the mistakes of the past and should not destroy our own economy.”

The third reason relates to defence economics more broadly. Today’s armed forces are far more efficient than the ones of the past. They need ever fewer people and their machines are ever more accurate. The economic theory of “cost disease” suggests that high-productivity sectors tend to command a smaller share of GDP over time (unlike something like health care, which tends to take up a bigger share). Spending a lot less than you did in 1945 can still buy you a powerful army.
 

Right_People

Junior Member
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The article does not paint a pretty picture. Is Ukraine capable of competent combined arms operations?!

The article addresses a lot of the issues regarding the training and command structure of Ukrainian armed forces. There are some suggestions on how to improve things in the article.

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It seems to me that there is a conflict within the AFU and both are partly right.
On the one hand there is the "Western Professional Soldier" mentality and on the other hand there is the "Soviet People's Army".
The other day someone posted in this thread that a Ukrainian commander said that NATO training was fine for fighting farmers, but in the steppes it failed.
At the same time a significant part of the Ukrainian army are mobiks with a few weeks of training, the best thing you can do with a 40 year old school teacher you just gave an AK to, is not to give him initiative, make sure he won't run out of his trench and shoot in the general direction of the enemy. Thats all.
Some of the proposals are simply unrealistic and completely stupid to try to implement, we have stories of battalions with 80% casualties replaced with mobiks and the article talks about "non-commissioned officers" with 10 years of experience, in US Army ...

Then there is also the part about "tanks are used more as mobile artillery and not in combined operations with infantry where the armor goes into action just ahead of the infantry", well that is the reality of this war, russians have adapted to it and brought T-62M and T-55 to be used for what their soldiers where doing, not trying to implement a doctrine that wasnt working (the initial AFU army was NATO trained, it knew all this), so why try to implement this?
Tanks in the first line in this conflict have extremely short life expectancy.
 
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baykalov

Senior Member
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To ask moderator Deino - is it permissible to only post links from Twitter in the thread without any explanation or text? As far as I know it's against the thread rules.

Or is it only for selected forum members?!

More details from the Bloomberg article:

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Chinese Defense Minister Li Shangfu extended an offer to his Ukrainian counterpart on Saturday to use “all means” of outreach possible to try to end Russia’s war, while also pledging to expand military communications with Kyiv, according to Ukraine’s deputy defense chief.

Li met with Defense Minister Oleksii Reznikov and his team Saturday on the sidelines of the Shangri-La Dialogue in Singapore, with China continuing to push for a role as peacemaker in the conflict despite its close political and economic ties to Moscow.

During the meeting, the Ukrainian side sought to deepen Beijing’s understanding of the situation on the ground, Deputy Defense Minister Volodymyr Havrylov said during an interview.

“They’re ready for communication to expand the contacts between Ukrainian and Chinese military leadership,” Havrylov said following his talks with Chinese officials. “I hope we will see some dynamics after the meeting.”

Beijing has ramped up efforts to negotiate an end to Russia’s war in Ukraine as part of a wider blueprint spearheaded by President Xi Jinping. Beijing’s proposal includes a call for a cease-fire, something that Ukraine, the US and its allies have all rejected because it would effectively help Russia consolidate territorial gains.

Earlier on Saturday, Indonesia Defense Minister Prabowo Subianto, passionately defended a new peace proposal for Ukraine that would leave Russian forces locked in place, saying Asian nations know the costs of war as well or better than their European counterparts.

That offer was dismissed by Reznikov, who said during a panel discussion earlier that “it sounds like a Russian plan, not an Indonesian plan.”

“We need to win this war, after that we will negotiate with the Kremlin regime or new leader,” he added.

Ukrainian officials were also in touch with the US delegation “on several occasions” during the conference in Singapore, Havrylov said, including a meeting between Reznikov and Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin on Friday.

“We have their full support,” he said.
 
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Maikeru

Major
Registered Member
To ask moderator Deino - is it permissible to only post links from Twitter in the thread without any explanation or text? As far as I know it's against the thread rules.

Or is it only for selected forum members?!

More details from the Bloomberg article:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Well if it is impermissible that's my bad and I apologise, I thought the content of the Tweet pretty much spoke for itself.
 
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