The War in the Ukraine

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Michaelsinodef

Senior Member
Registered Member
abc123 said:
So, Russia with an economy about 10x smaller than NATO has time on its side? Hunderds of Armatas, Su-57, Kurganets, Boomerangs etc. are rolling from factory lines daily?
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If the whole of NATO was actually sending all their stuff they produce from their factories to Ukraine (everything from F-16, F-18EX, F-35 to tanks and other ground vehicles etc.), then yea, time definitely wouldn't be on Russia's side.

But it's pretty darn clear they aren't doing that, and so in comparison to what Ukraine is getting vs what Russia is making and sending to its frontline, we have Russia > Ukraine, and therefore also time on Russia's side (and it's manufacturing 'outperforming' Ukraine backed by the west/NATO).
 
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sheogorath

Major
Registered Member
abc123 said:
So, Russia with an economy about 10x smaller than NATO has time on its side? Hunderds of Armatas, Su-57, Kurganets, Boomerangs etc. are rolling from factory lines daily?
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At this point, you'd think people would have figured out GDP isn't really a reliable metric for anything. Russia does have a "smaller" economy but also a Euro or a Dollar in Russia will get you further R&D and Manufacturing wise than the same dollar will in the US or the EU.

In certain metrics, China's economy is "smaller" than that of the US yet China produces more than the US, Japan and Germany combined. Being Financial hubs schews "economy size" arguments, but at the end of the day, banks and money launderers don't produce anything, they don't build tanks, cars, computers, etc.

As it is, Russia produces more artillery ammo, tanks and other systems than what the entire NATO can produce right now despite a "smaller economy"
 
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Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
typexx said:
The first documented use by the Ukrainian army of the Russian ATGM "Kornet". According to the tweet, they were handed over by Jordan
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1631235512550969346
until now jordan has supplied ukraine with kornet and RPG-32
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They have been handed this summer ??? Still didn't see chinese ATGM on the front. Every other types more or less have been tested in Ukraine. Bosnian had some HJ-8 but I don't see a lot of possibilities that the countries having them will give some to Ukraine.
 
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drowingfish

Junior Member
Registered Member
Temstar said:
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1631220844931452930
There are rumors of an uprising among Ukrainian rank at Bakhmut. I saw this earlier in the day and dismissed it but DPA who I follow and consider to be fairly reliable is now reporting it.
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there is no surprise in this. especially considering that the soldiers in bakhmut now are likely mobilized ones that get abused by both sides. i imagine it is less an uprising but rather refusal to carry out certain orders.
 
solarz

solarz

Brigadier
Atomicfrog said:
They have been handed this summer ??? Still didn't see chinese ATGM on the front. Every other types more or less have been tested in Ukraine. Bosnian had some HJ-8 but I don't see a lot of possibilities that the countries having them will give some to Ukraine.
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What happened to all those claims of Javelin wonder weapons? Seems like it disappeared off the radar completely in the past months.
 
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Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
solarz said:
What happened to all those claims of Javelin wonder weapons? Seems like it disappeared off the radar completely in the past months.
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Mission and combat losses from ATGM are probably been high, Javelin have probably contributed to the toll like all other ATGM used in the conflict... I don't know and we probably will never know the ratio of them being used well against the one being discarded, lost, destroyed and sold to black markets. With the Leopard fiasco, i'm not even sure if we can rely on numbers provided.

I think manpads influences have a bigger weight on combat progress than Javelin have achieved.
 
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sheogorath

Major
Registered Member
solarz said:
What happened to all those claims of Javelin wonder weapons? Seems like it disappeared off the radar completely in the past months.
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There was a video of one being used against a T-90M a few weeks ago but other than that. It might be a combination of the issue of being relatively short legged ATGM with the issue we read about early in the war of the Ukranians using the launchers' thermal for scouting and observation which caused them to run out of battery which wasn't easy to replace

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A key problem Ukrainians were having centered on the massive battery used to power the Javelin and its optics, the Command Launch Unit, or CLU. That optics system is used for the missile but is also employed to observe enemy movements from a far distance.

"They were running out of the brick batteries and were using motorcycle and car batteries to power the CLUs," he said.
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