The Chinese Cruiser, forget the carrier...

Gauntlet

Junior Member
MIGleader said:
plus
Fixed Wing: 20 Su-27K Flanker D
4 Su-25 UTG Frogfoot
Helicopters: 15 Ka-27 Helix
3 Ka-29 Helix AEW
Love your post, but I will have to correct something here.

Due to canceling of both the Freestyle and Fulcrum-D (in the Russian case atleast), the Kuznetsov now operates 2 full squadrons of Flanker-Ds. That means 20-24 planes. (that is what you said, I just "agreed"). Estimated production of the Su-33 seems to be 30-50 planes.

However, the UTGs are not part of Kuznetsovs airwing. They are only used for training as their combat equipment has been removed to make room for a second man, strengthening of the fuselage and various carrier equipment. 10 UTGs were produced, 5 for Ukraine and 5 for Russia. Russia lost one is a crash, and now only have 4.

For the spinner fleet, it consists of about 18 Helix-A ASW choppers, 4 Helix-D SAR choppers and 2 Ka-31 Helix-B (E?) AEW choppers. To this day about 100 Helix-As and Ds have been built for Russia, while probarly only 2-3 Ka-31 have been built. Its not likely that the Kuznetsov is using Ka-31s ATM, but will probarly do it in the near future.

In the furture Su-33UBs/Su-27KUBs will be part of the operational fleet with advance strike capability AND training purposes for the Flanker-D pilots. To this date, only 1 plane is flying.

Heres a RAR file I put together, with alot(!) of pictures showing the Kuznetsov with its air-wing.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!



PS: Be nice, this was my first post.

(BTW, great forum)

bd popeye said:
But..I don't think the Kuznetsov is a cruiser. To me it is a CV. It is just very heavily armed. It could sail with limited escorts.
Well, seeing the orginal mission of the Kuznetsov were to support their submarines, I would classify it as a Cruiser with a heavy air wing.

Its Shipwreck missiles are not to be overlooked, as they are massive and leathal weapons.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Gollevainen

Colonel
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Admiral flota sovejetski sojuz Kuznetsov is pure aircraft carrier desinged to be one from the scratch. Those granit missiles doesent make it anyway less carrier, just gives it a better punch than many cruisers. Kiev's migth have been called cruisers, but the term taktiskoje aviatzia kreiserna(or something sounding like that:confused: ) comes from the fact that as they were build in Nikolajev docks in Black Sea. Order to get them truogh Bosboriouz straits, they needed that kind of desingnation as international treatyes forbids aircraft carriers to pass trough them. Kuznetsov was also build in Ukraine thus the same desingnation. I have seen soviet documentary about Kiev when she was bran new, and the it was called aviatzia koralb (or aviation ship in London's dialect).
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Gauntlet, I'm sure the regular posters in this forum appericate your kind comments about this forum.

This link ...
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.. did not allow me to recieve any pictures. If you could post them here I know I would appericate it.

Thanks. And welcome to the forum!
 

Gauntlet

Junior Member
bd popeye said:
Gauntlet, I'm sure the regular posters in this forum appericate your kind comments about this forum.

This link ...
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.. did not allow me to recieve any pictures. If you could post them here I know I would appericate it.

Thanks. And welcome to the forum!
If you click "download file" you will download the rar file (20mb aprox) which I uploaded there. Its crammed full of the Kuznetsov and various Russian carrier planes/choppers (~300 pics).

Oh, and thanks for the welcome! :)
 

Sea Dog

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Gollevainen said:
Admiral flota sovejetski sojuz Kuznetsov is pure aircraft carrier desinged to be one from the scratch. Those granit missiles doesent make it anyway less carrier, just gives it a better punch than many cruisers.

Yes. The Kuznetzov made room for these missiles to overcome it's inability to field a significantly sized airwing. And it does give the Kuznetzov a good lethal reach.
 

Gauntlet

Junior Member
And the Shipwrecks also did the Kuznetsov more independent from US carriers, meaning it could risk engaging surface targets themself, a luxuary the US carrier doesnt have.

However, in an real life situation, using the Kuznetsov offensive would be the same as suicide.

Btw, is the any information regarding if the future Varyag will also have ASM missiles mounted under the front deck? Or would they remove them and modify the carrier to have an larger hangar deck?
 

Sea Dog

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Gauntlet said:
And the Shipwrecks also did the Kuznetsov more independent from US carriers, meaning it could risk engaging surface targets themself, a luxuary the US carrier doesnt have.

However, in an real life situation, using the Kuznetsov offensive would be the same as suicide.

Btw, is the any information regarding if the future Varyag will also have ASM missiles mounted under the front deck? Or would they remove them and modify the carrier to have an larger hangar deck?

Well Gauntlet, it depends on how you look at it. The US carriers do engage surface targets themselves. But thier anti-ship weapons come from swarms of missiles and Electronic attacks from carrier aircraft. This gives US carriers a longer and more potent reach than any other carrier in the world.
 

Gauntlet

Junior Member
Sea Dog said:
Well Gauntlet, it depends on how you look at it. The US carriers do engage surface targets themselves. But thier anti-ship weapons come from swarms of missiles and Electronic attacks from carrier aircraft. This gives US carriers a longer and more potent reach than any other carrier in the world.
True.

But I was thinking in the lines of the ship themself, without any support. But then again, what would an carrier be without an airwing as support...

So, you do have right. Sorry.
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
If you click "download file" you will download the rar file (20mb aprox) which I uploaded there. Its crammed full of the Kuznetsov and various Russian carrier planes/choppers (~300 pics).

Sorry, My sorry server won't operate on that web site. I will probaly use the libary to see them.....Thanks anyway..
 

Soyuz

New Member
Btw, is the any information regarding if the future Varyag will also have ASM missiles mounted under the front deck? Or would they remove them and modify the carrier to have an larger hangar deck?

ON the old forum There were pics of a model of a refitted varyag (i would post a link or something but unfortunately computers seem to hate me!) armed with what looked to me to be

32 yj-85 (c-805) anti ship missiles in 8 4 cell launchers
60 HQ-6 SAM in 10 6 cell VLSs
4 Type-730 CIWSs

Although the models also showed J-8s as part of the airwing so i'm not sure how accurate a representation the model was of the refitted varyag!
 
Top