Taiwan's Reaction to PLA Force Modernization

Early batch of F-16As are literally WVR only fighters. Short ranged radar, no BVR even for Sparrows. The APG-67 for the Tigershark was superior in all respects to the early APG-66, and that was before it gets evolved further into the GD-53 for the F-CK-1.

The Block 20 of the ROCAF represents the final upgraded edition of the F-16A/B. By far the majority of F-16A/Bs in this world are the basic WVR only fighters, until they are upgraded. The Block 20 are the only F-16As that were built with the updates standard, and are the last F-16As ever built.

APG-66v2 used on the ROCAF Block 20 is an upgraded APG-66 that features many updates, including modular mission computer, use of AMRAAM, Maverick and Harpoon, and for all respects, is virtually a technical match to the APG-68v7 used on the Block 50/52. In fact, the Block 50/52 planes were later upgraded with stuff that first appeared on the Block 20. Block 20 also introduced such things like AIFF, whose antennas are the characteristic bird slicers you see on top of the nose. You only find these bird slicers on the latest F-16s and the Japanese F-2, as well as Block 2 Super Hornets.

The F-CK-1C/D has avionics improvement that reaches to the same level as the Block 20, including the incorporation of AIFF. The number of BVRAAMs it can carry is now enlarged from 2 to 4, and fuel capacity is also increased slightly. I also heard there may be some engine tweaks too. There may also be some unmentioned avionics improvements.

I kind of like the F-CK-1, especially in appearance. It's small but very sleek, appeasing to the eye. Its TWR is not as good as an F-16A, but its not that far behind either. It's thrust to weight ratio is approximately the same as the new JF-17, although its internal fuel capacity is smaller, so endurance is where its going to bite the most.

I agree with you in all of the above,


However I suspect the FCK-1C/D (upgarded version) will trump the JF-17 in the avionics department as rumours have been flying around the FCK-1C/D will be upgraded with an "AESA" radar-and given the horrific information leakage from the ROC Armed Forces this has a good chance of being true.

I doubt that the F-CK-1C/D will get AESA. It sounds like the same GD-53 with some improvements.

From what I have been hearing on the JF-17 radar, it seems the other way around may be more true. The radar on the JF-17 can trump the F-CK-1. The FC-1 radar can track targets as far as 125km, detect 40 of them, track while scan around 10 of them, engage 4 of them with ARH missiles or 2 of them with SARH missiles. It has things like MTI or Moving Target Indicator. The RWR on the FC-1 is claimed to have as many as 500 radar signatures, and furthermore, it has an optical MAWS (Missile Approach Warning System), something you don't usually see except on the Typhoon. What more, the ROCAF seems to be admitting that the PL-12 trumps the TC-2 of the F-CK-1. The FC-1 also has a HMS and IRST option, and I believe the upgraded PL-8B has wider off boresight than the TC-1 of the F-CK-1. And certainly from what we have seen, the FC-1's glass cockpit looks a lot more modern.

Even here, the Ching Kuo C/D upgrade seems a bit short even against the PLAAF's potential future low ender.

On the other hand, I still think the styling and looks of the Ching Kuo looks cooler than the Owlet Dragon.

Yeah, but keep in mind the JF-17 specs may have been exaggerated to make it sound very competitive on the export market-Lockheed Martin, BAE, Dassault and Boeing have been doing it for decades-the USAF has been known to 'dumb down' their specs to confuse enemies as to their real capabilities so I think thats what the ROCAF and AIDC will be doing too.

I'm afraid only time will tell which is the better aircraft-too bad the two Chinese states have to fight each other to prove it.

UCSDAE said:

The M series SRBM, with GPS guidance, has a CEP of 100m, so for AFBs is accurate enough. Beidou is coming online soon, and presumely, it will provide accuracy equivalent to that of GPS(otherwise, why would the PLA even bother) in the East Asia region. Beidou will provide global coverage in a few years time IMO.

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Ballistic missiles are no good weapon against Taiwan, they poses merely political tool with their possiple nuclear tipping, and thats the sole reason those missiles are so heavily consentrated towards Taiwan, but dont get fooled by the charts that mentions normal warheads with these missiles that PLA is actually using them to do precission strikes against Taiwan in possiple conflict.
With CEP of 100m its not worthwhile against anything else but vastly populated cities if one wants to wage terror-war, but that accuracy, and expecially the small size of their warheads arent worth of anything else than make sizable hole somewhere around the airstrip. Big deal, if you want to take out airstrips, you need to have thousands of holes in there, and millions of little minelets to keep all repair crews in distance....

....And I hate to repeat this every single time since some kid gets this 'brilliant' idea of how to whipe out Taiwanese airforces, SO DO SOME RESEARCH OF BASIC MILITARY MATTERS BEFORE COME POSTING UNDER MY WATCH!!!!!!!:nono:

well...looks like Chinese Forces need some Cruise Missile with Multiple Warhead that will pick their own target :rofl: or maybe some long Range Supersonic Bombers...to blast their AFB

with the resent outrage all over asia regarding comments in which japan's refusal to take proper responibilty of sex slaves in WW2 ...after that I think many countries in asia will think twice before supporting japan's bid of a UNSC seat..

If they could pulverize a satellite with a BM why can't they improve the accuracy of IR/SRBMs? In fact, that's what they are going to do, not only for those aimed at ROC but also for potential use against CSGs.

hongkongpride said:

Yeah, but keep in mind the JF-17 specs may have been exaggerated to make it sound very competitive on the export market-Lockheed Martin, BAE, Dassault and Boeing have been doing it for decades-the USAF has been known to 'dumb down' their specs to confuse enemies as to their real capabilities so I think thats what the ROCAF and AIDC will be doing too.

I'm afraid only time will tell which is the better aircraft-too bad the two Chinese states have to fight each other to prove it.

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Those are not specs being mentioned, those are features in the avionics. I have never seen the specs buffed up, and in fact, given the changes in PT04, it should have been raised. The official specs are still the old ones, pre DSI .

The Pakistanis have been demanding beefing up the capabilities of the plane in order to match Indian developments. The fact that the plane is not 'finished' yet, while the J-10 is finished, means that the FC-1 can avail of even later avionics developments that the current production J-10 has missed. Despite the "lowly" status of the Fc-1, it can mean things like the radar is newer among other things, until the J-10 gets a new revision.

The optical MAWS is certainly no empty boast. We have seen that installed on the tail of the J-11B, and PT04 has a special bulge in the tail that is exactly in the right size and location for such.

I can understand the dumbing down part. Lately the PLAAF seems to be trying to dumb down the J-10 a bit as well. However, there is also no new clean news that the radar gets a serious change like to AESA. As a matter of fact, the Block 52+ F-16s Taiwan is interested to buy is still using a mechanically scanning slotted waveguide planar array. Old style. The Block 52+ isn't that much of an improvement over the Block 20. It has better thrust, but wing loading is higher so it can't turn as fast as the older plane. It can engage at least four targets now instead of two, and the biggest improvements may be its ability to use JHCMS and AIM-9X.

Going back to the F-CK-1 C/D, we have not seen any improvements on the TC-1 and TC-2 missiles, and we have not seen anything to suggest it can use AIM-9X or AMRAAM C7. Even with the occasional hype or dumbdown, at least news on the US side tends to be transparent, and if there is such developments, it would been known, since it was known and publicized on the F-16s.

One advantage I forgot to mention over the FC-1, is that at least the Ching Kuo sports a robust datalink, while the datalink on the FC-1 can be described as something as a work in progress. Nonetheless, for onboard sensors, my vote goes to the FC-1.

I googled translated this off from this webpage.



Western assessment : PLA Air Force pilot over Taiwan decreased morale

Western assessments : PLA pilot over the quality of Taiwan's People's Liberation Army has deployed a large number of new fighters recently. Taiwan's top achieving slightly better overall quality of its pilots to prepare for the PLA. But the overall assessment is that Western military experts, PLA pilot training in quality have all combat capability and psychological quality over Taiwan. According to "China's defense," reported that Taiwan experts stressed that the PLA Air Force flying hours over, But no comprehensive response to the Air Force flight hours and the standard of training, because the data are subject to oil supply. Body lifetime conditions. Air Force flight hours mainland slightly less than Taiwan, but also a lot of ground preparation. The mainland is a comprehensive summary of various combat situations, they could be divided into different subjects pilots practicing extremely focused. Another exception, since the third-generation fighter plane and has sufficient funds to increase the mainland air force training intensity and precision. and foreign exchange has achieved many breakthroughs. Taiwan's air force has been resting on his laurels, even capital investment, a lack of legitimacy. According to informed sources, the Taiwan Air Force F-16 fighters are used as missiles are bluffing. Taiwan has never conducted a missile firing exercises, because the cost is too high, the military can not afford them. Taiwan air force pilots envy of the People's Liberation Army stationed in Fujian, a reasonable missile launch training program. Taiwan's Air Force to spend huge sums of money to the mid-1990s invited European experts. building in central Taiwan in a very advanced and concealed the secret Air Force Base. The base built in 2000, the then highly classified military. it has not opened for one year after the completion of the pilot training. Results of the 2001 summer, fully consistent with the size of a council of the People's Liberation Army base on Hainan Island, built and put into use. This move shows the strong People's Liberation Army Air Force reconnaissance capability, Taiwan also announced equivalent to a "secret base" no longer has any strategic significance. From the confidence point of view, the pilot was not in the Taiwan Strait is a notch, and even showed a reverse trend of development. On one hand, the liberation of Air Force equipment continues to be optimized, training standards, making the pilot's self-confidence. F-7 fighter of the old Soviet system into a more advanced F-10 warplanes and self-created. Taiwan's F-16 during the confrontation, the psychological pressure were significantly different. The other hand, Taiwan's air force increasingly pessimistic judgment on the outcome of a war, leading to decreased morale. All pilots are worried, "Bingbairushandao" the day will come sooner or later. Especially since 2007, the military policy of "increasing tension in the Taiwan Strait" speculations, all speculation, American troops will really involved? Taiwan will top in the end?