Syrian Crisis...2013

Re: Mediterranean Naval Forces

plawolf said:

This is precisely why I think China should have naval assets in the region.

Any data the Syrians have would be fragmented and likely incomplete as a result of the strikes. That is assuming the Syrians give China everything they have.

An 054A sitting a few score miles off the coast can get a front role seat and soak up all the emissions and signals from all sides and also get a play by play of how the US conducts SEAD/DEAD missions. If the Russians decide to mess with the Americans by either actively emitting and illuminating US cruise missiles and aircraft for Syrian systems or directly engage US tomahawks themselves, then China will get to see how effective that is and how the US might respond.

That is a far better and safer intelligence gathering operation than some operatives on the ground with man portable sets who might be subject to another 'map error' strike by the US.

Click to expand...

They would certainly get a front row seat as you state, and would gain a lot more information about how the Chinese systems fair.

But they would also be taking a large risk being that close to the attacks themselves. And the PRC would come off internationally as taking abject advantage of a situation that is clearly very serious and does not really involve them. So they would have to carefully weigh all the factors.

As it is, it is getting late. I believe that Obama is apt to order the strike within the next 2-3 days.

Re: Persian Gulf & Middle East News & Views

Turkish prime mister Erdogan was Assads closest allie who expand traded and opened borders just less than 3 years ago

Last night he said that limited strikes aren't enough they must take down the Assad regime and wipe thier military clean

He's a guy who knows what he's talking about so I hope they now go in and wipe out Assad so we get regime change

If US makes some limited strikes and takes down the command and control and integrated air defence then the Turkish air force can make a sweep and take out the rest of the militray, I hope Turkey does it

Re: Mediterranean Naval Forces

Jeff Head said:

They would certainly get a front row seat as you state, and would gain a lot more information about how the Chinese systems fair.

But they would also be taking a large risk being that close to the attacks themselves. And the PRC would come off internationally as taking abject advantage of a situation that is clearly very serious and does not really involve them. So they would have to carefully weigh all the factors.

As it is, it is getting late. I believe that Obama is apt to order the strike within the next 2-3 days.

Click to expand...

Well the cover story would be that the warship or warships are there to monitor the situation and be on standby to pull Chinese nationals out in case the strikes destabilise the entire region, which is actually quite plausible if Assad fights back rather than just bend over and take it. I doubt China would get too much blowback internationally over a small naval deployment. Those who would interpret that move in a negative light would probably find a way to fault China no matter what it did.

As for danger, well if the 054A's defences or SOP cannot handle a rough tomahawk or two, than its better to find out this way and fix the issue now rather than find out during an actual war involving the PLAN.

But as you say, the clock is fast ticking down on this, and tbh, its probably already too late to retask a ship now. That is one of the problems with Beijing, too risk averse and slow to react sometimes, and they miss a lot of good opportunities. But I suppose the flip side is they don't rush into things without thinking it thoroughly through so are less prone at making rash decisions so it balances out.

Re: Mediterranean Naval Forces

I think PLAN has everything to loose and nothing to gain in such a situation

Also I highly doubt China need to test how to track a Tomahawk using Type 054A

CCP is very mature and know exactly what they are doing

Re: Persian Gulf & Middle East News & Views

TerraN_EmpirE said:

and the story keeps going.

Click to expand...

It's of course all right for the US to encourage its friends in Saudi Arabia and Qatar to finance the rebels, and for the CIA to assist, thus causing 200000 deaths in Syria or for the Egyptian military to murder thousands of unarmed citizens but if someone unknown uses poison gas in Syria the government of that country needs to be "punished".
Fortunately ever more countries refuse to support the US - UK, Germany and The Netherlands among them.

Re: Persian Gulf & Middle East News & Views

Here's another report.

AP/BBC correspondent (20 years mid east veteran Dale Gavlak) reports that Syrian Rebel fighters admit chemical weapons release a result of mishandling by rebels. Have you seen this report by this very experienced journalist in any US main stream media outlet?



The public in the US is being force fed absolutely one side of this issue. This is a report by a long time, respected journalist who went into the impacted areas and spoke directly with the people effected and with rebels on the ground. This report is being carried throughout Europe, in the Middle East, Asia, Russia, etc. but not in the US (except in the blogosphere) I personally still believe that events surrounding what was going on at Benghazi is all wrapped up in this.

Re: Mediterranean Naval Forces

asif iqbal said:

I think PLAN has everything to loose and nothing to gain in such a situation

Also I highly doubt China need to test how to track a Tomahawk using Type 054A

CCP is very mature and know exactly what they are doing

Click to expand...

Just what exactly does the PLAN risk loosing? Their ships won't be going in to take sides, but stand as a neutral party ready to evacuate Chinese nationals if the situation spins out of control.

If anything, the presence of the ships would force the US to take Chinese interests and concerns into greater consideration during any operations as the last thing they want is to make the PLAN stand with the Russians.

The true intel prize is not to test how well the 054A might detect tomahawks, but rather to collect any EW and wartime radar frequencies US and other western forces might emit during a strike against Syria.

Israel manage to hack into syrian air defense.
according to armada mag. US may use similiar cyber warfare against pakistan air defense during target killing of OBL.
.

Chinese LF radar may be more advance than the previous gen. employed by the then Soviet.
during mid-80's conflict in Chad,france manage to obtain some sample of soviet made UHF radar.french are surprise not only from there simplicity(or soldier proof) and there ECCM.
but the syrian AD operators suffer from high rate of desertion,right now syrian air defense is just a empty shell.

it may look like the the russian and syrian are using "disinformation" against report of syrian gas attack. but again, big question is this, what is the consequence,if US or brit. attack the syrian regime? what if assad regime fell? chemical weapon fell into al-queda could found there way into iraq,israel,europe and NY subway.(or even china and russia)?

Re: Aircraft Carriers II

Pointblank said:

Coupled with the USS Nimitz, as her deployment in the Indian Ocean has been extended as well.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

As we know, ships can easily be moved around to where they are needed, so if necessary, they could send Nimitz to the Red Sea for support.

Click to expand...

I believe the two US carriers will play no part in the operation regarding the attack on Syria.

However, they are there, both of them at the same time, to provide a huge contingency should Iran decide to enter the conflict...and perhaps that is another "wheel within wheels," regarding this. Perhaps the US is trying to give Iran a pretext to enter the fray so the US and Israel can then go in there and supress Iran and take down their nuclear program.

That's an interesting lead to follow on and consider.

Re: Mediterranean Naval Forces

Interestingly, in that 2011 deployment, on 1 March 2011 , Commander Nathan Borchers, Command Master Chief Susan Bruce-Ross, six other chiefs, one junior officer, and one petty officer of USS Stout were relieved by the Commander Sixth Fleet. The cited cause was a “pervasive pattern of unprofessional behavior” among the ship's crew including “fraternization, orders violations and disregard for naval standards of conduct and behavior which contributed to poor crew morale and a hostile command climate."

Click to expand...

Translation .. alcohol abuse and sexual fraternization. I've been in this type situation before and once the main characters are removed the situation and morale change drastically.

This has nothing to do with Stout ability to perform at this time two years later.

This whole situation with Syria is another quagmire waiting to happen.