Syria Shoots Down Turkish Fighter Jet
- Thread starter SteelBird
- Start date
plawolf
Lieutenant General
A very good piece on the likely cause of Annan's resignation.
It is interesting to note the near silence of all the other major western media outlets on this very significant development. Sure they all reported the news that Annan resigned, but there has been surprisingly little commentary and analysis of why he resigned. Now we know why.
It is interesting to note the near silence of all the other major western media outlets on this very significant development. Sure they all reported the news that Annan resigned, but there has been surprisingly little commentary and analysis of why he resigned. Now we know why.
Kurt
Junior Member
I somehow get the feeling that South Africa (and Ruanda to some degree) handled that issue pretty well with their truth and reconciliation commissions ending apartheid (the civil war), although perceived economic chances for whites suffered. If you really want change, you need determination and limits on violence because revenge and anger wrecks future perspectives of cooperation for mutual benefits.
Great news, because the German sources are silent on both issues and continue to feed the narrative of the brave FSA fighters for democracy with Western weapon support for humanitarian reasons.
Great news, because the German sources are silent on both issues and continue to feed the narrative of the brave FSA fighters for democracy with Western weapon support for humanitarian reasons.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
everyone seems to be pot shoting Turkish troops these days, this is why its so important that T-129 is operational like ASAP, this is why Turkey is investing around $5 billion in their attack helicopter programme, they really really need them like yesterday
once Turkey gets T-129 they wil lbe able to fly in and out and attack at will, T-129 is designed to take RPG and 12.7mm fire, attack helos are so vital for these kind of operations
once Turkey gets T-129 they wil lbe able to fly in and out and attack at will, T-129 is designed to take RPG and 12.7mm fire, attack helos are so vital for these kind of operations
Kurt
Junior Member
Don't attack your neighbour or host armed groups that transgress the border? Normally states try to avoid such issues because you would call that aggression. Syria doesn't because it has no intent on invading a NATO member and take the alliance's wrath.
The reports about Turkish troops being pot shot has probably some propagandistic background. If my feeling for the Turkish mindset is correct the news are meant to entice a backlash that drives the war-weary population to war. Do they still miss a Gulf of Tonkin incident?
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
as i have said many times before Turkey is a responsible neighbour and power and know a thing or two about the region since they ruled from the Persian Gulf to the Europe during Ottoman Times, they are not greedy for land
even Israel murdered 12 Turkish nationals on the freedom flotilla in 2010 and Turkey never took any military action even although they could have, Kurds been killing Turks for last 30 years and thousands of Turks been killed but Turkey never took the drastic action they should have
and Turkey does not need NATO to back it up, cus they have a 1 million man standing army they can look after themselves
Turkish people are very nice and have always been there for Pakistan and many other country’s during their time of need, they have proved to be time trusted friends, their military is strong, professional and disciplined and I can not see them as aggressors in this conflict, Turkey is being too soft with Syria and its time they really nailed the Syrian Military, if Erdogan calls it, tomorrow lunchtime Turkish troops can be in centre of Damascus
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Well Turkey has repeatedly launched incursions into Iraqi territory, is actively and openly arming, training, sheltering and financing armed groups intent on the overthrow of a neighbor's government, violates Greek airspace as a matter of course and many other things I cannot be bothered to list. Hardly the track record of a responsible power or neighbor.
The Turks might not be greedy for land, but they are greedy for influence and power, and that sometimes can be more dangerous and damaging than simply land envy.
Realistically, who do you honestly think would have came out worse off if Turkey hard tried to launch military strikes on Israel in retaliation for the killings?
If Pakistan really wanted to, it could quiet legitimately declare war on the US for all the drone strikes and incursions US forces have made on Pakistani territory. As I am sure you can appreciate, there is often a vast gulf between what you can do, and what is realistic and sensible to do.
Tell that to the Kurds.
Well, I think we need to separate out our personal feelings about the people and the assessment of what their government is doing. i agree with you on all regards with respect to the Turkish people, but that does not mean that Turkey could do no wrong.
Well, I think you exaggerate a little with the speed of which the Turkish military might be able to reach downtown Damascus, but then they might be mired in the inter-everything feuding and fighting for the next 10 years with no end in sight. The Turks would have to be stupid to want to put their troops in the middle of the chaotic mess that is Syria right now. With situations like Syria's, getting in easy, it's how to get out again that is hard. Just ask the Americans wrt Iraq.
As I understand it, the biggest potential problem Turkey would have mounting a major military operation is that some 40 out of 60 of its most senior Generals are currently under indictment for attempting a coup against Erdogan in 2004.
I would also point out, that the current fighting in Turkey with the Kurds is against the Iran/Iraq border intersection and a long way from Syria. I see this as a severe warning as any attempt by Turkey to pursue rebels across either border could have very serious consequences.
Likewise the kidnap of Iranian pilgrims in Syria by Sunni militants presents another open door for more overt Iranian actions.
I would also point out, that the current fighting in Turkey with the Kurds is against the Iran/Iraq border intersection and a long way from Syria. I see this as a severe warning as any attempt by Turkey to pursue rebels across either border could have very serious consequences.
Likewise the kidnap of Iranian pilgrims in Syria by Sunni militants presents another open door for more overt Iranian actions.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Israel killed the Turks when they didnt know they were Turkish, had Israel known who were onboard they would never have opened fire
Israel recognises all genocides and killings throughout the world, but the refuse Armenian Genocide, you know why? cus it will annoy the Turks really bad and that is something Israel cant afford, Israel knows its existance relys upon peace with one country and that is Turkey, this is why Israel is so friendly with them, on the other hand Turkey knows that it is the muslim country that recognises Israel, and for that it has huge influence
Turkey even offered to mediate the enrichment process for Iran because they always try and make peaceful resolution for everyone in region
Turkey is playing the frontline in rebuilding Iraq, have you seen Sulimaniya or Irbil? Kurdistan is getting billions in FDI from turkey for rebuilding entire Northern Iraq, Turkey construction companys making roads to Turkish Banks giving generous loan terms
Your understanding of Turkey is flawed, and if it is based on Turkish support for North Western Muslims in China then that’s have political agenda which I will not engage in
Kurt
Junior Member
Turkey has armed groups with hostile intent to the Syrian government crossing the Turkish border for their raids and using Turkey as a refugee and training ground.
I don't want to argue about the size of the Turkish army, but does men under arms equal combat capability or is there a force multiplication factor through equipment and logistics? All neighbours recognize Turkey as a great power and it has a leading position among the Turk nations and tribes.
The problem is, are they opening a can of worms by the acts they already commited to the detriment of their neighbour?
I don't want to argue about the size of the Turkish army, but does men under arms equal combat capability or is there a force multiplication factor through equipment and logistics? All neighbours recognize Turkey as a great power and it has a leading position among the Turk nations and tribes.
The problem is, are they opening a can of worms by the acts they already commited to the detriment of their neighbour?