Submarines for the Argentine Navy

Miragedriver

Miragedriver

Brigadier
The following article which appeared in the
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places the Scorpene and SSN projects into a larger context.

“The Brazilian navy is planning to build and incorporate in the next decade a fleet of six nuclear powered and 20 conventional submersibles (15 new and five refurbished).... Conventional submarines will be built in two lots with a first batch of 15 new ones, of which four of them will be a reformed version of the French Scorpion with an additional 100 tons displacement and five meters longer. The other five includes the current five [SSK Tupi and SSK Tikuna Class] submersibles that will be refurbished. The first [Scorpene] is scheduled to be delivered in the second half of 2016 and the rest in the period extending to 2021.”

With respect to the nuclear submarine program, control of the entire uranium enrichment process is step 1. Uranium gas has reportedly begun trials at a $130 million plant in Iperó, and full production capacity is reported as 40 tones
 
Miragedriver

Miragedriver

Brigadier
There was a article in the Mercpress that the Japnese government is considering the sale of it’s retireing Harushio class submarines to the Aregntine Navy.

Do any of the forum member have any knowledge or information regarding the Harushio class submarines?
 
TerraN_EmpirE

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
The Japanese are very strict about there military exports I doubt the Sale.
The Harushio class is a Diesel electric still in active service with the first three have all been retired. She packs 6 torpedo tubes firing torpedoes and harpoons crew of 75, 77 meters long, 2450 tons on the surface 20 knot top speed submerged 12 on the surface.
 
D

Denis_469

New Member
Miragedriver said:
There was a article in the Mercpress that the Japnese government is considering the sale of it’s retireing Harushio class submarines to the Aregntine Navy.

Do any of the forum member have any knowledge or information regarding the Harushio class submarines?
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Japan submarine is poor and have short live time. Normal submarines live near 25-30 years, but IJN subs live 15-18 years only. It say, that IJN submarines made poorly and can not use more then 15-20 years for phisical conditions.
So Argentina not need in this scrap from Japan. Would be best, if you buy russian submarines 636M project (Kilo). Price in this subs near 300 M $.

I can say , that Argentina need buy russian weapons, so western countryes can sell to Argentina defect weapons. And you can see it in 1982 year, when all torpedoes fired from Argentinian submarine missing.
 
bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Japan submarine is poor and have short live time. Normal submarines live near 25-30 years, but IJN subs live 15-18 years only. It say, that IJN submarines made poorly and can not use more then 15-20 years for physical conditions.
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Huh? Do you have some proof to back up that statement? And Japan's navy has not been called the IJN for over 65 years...It's the Japanese maritime Self Defence Force.

Here's some info on the Japanese Harushio class sub. I don't think Argentina will get any of these subs. No way.

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SS Harushio Class

The SS Harushio class is a 3rd generation submarine, and uses a tear drop type hull. It is technically derived from the previous Yushio class and there is no major advancement, but silent running quality is improved [with a decrease of self noise] and there are some improvements in underwater capability.

Because is is a slightly enlarged and revised edition of the Yushio type, the silhouette is similar, but there is a projection section of the countermeasure intelligence sonar where it differs in the appearance extending to the bow top that makes it is possible to distinguish them. The hull was extended about 1 meter in total length attendant upon inside of warship space enlargement in comparison with the Yushio type.

Many characteristics of the submarines of the Maritime Self Defense Force are not published, with secrecy concerning maximum depth. The Harushio class uses the NS110 high strength steel in portions of the pressure-resistant boat hull, and the operating depth is presumed to be 300 meters or more. Making use of NS90 steel and the NS110 steel, the safe operating depth for the pressure-resistant boat hull is said by some sources to be 500 meters.

The Harushio class, is equipped with the the ZQQ sonar and TASS for bow sonar. The torpedo system uses the domestic 89 type torpedoes to assure improving the torpedo attack power.

The budget for the Harushio class was estimated at 38,673,000,000 Yen, but construction expenses increased substantially, to 44,266,000,000 Yen ago. As for the breakdown, the hulls cost 26,558,000,000 Yen, the main electric motors 1,433,000,000 Yen, the main generators 1,792,000,000 Yen, and the main storage batteries reached 2,185,000,000 Yen. The remainder of the electronic equipment and the like probably is 10,000,000,000.

The last unit of this class, the Asashio, began a new practice of the Submarine Division which was executed in 1999. In March 2000 the Asashio was redesignated as a training submarine (the TSS 3601), and was modified for this role. Until recently, modifying an old-fashioned submarine into an auxiliary vessel was the norm for training submarine crew members. But because these older vessels had restricted periscope depth, range and the like, this became less useful for training. It was decided to use as a training ship a vessel which had the characteristics of newly-built ship, and which possessed the same search and attack equipment.

The National Defense Program Guidelines in and after JFY 2005 and Mid-Term Defense Program (JFY 2005-2009) were adopted by the Security Council and the Cabinet on 10 December 2004. The latest changes to MSDF organisation was elaborated in the December 2004 guiding documents, the National Defence Program Outline (NDPO) and the Mid-Term Defence Program (MDP). It called for maintaining the number of combat-coded submarines at 16. This would imply withdrawing two additional Harushio class submarines from service by 2010 that would otherwise remain in service through the 2015 timeframe. Possibly these boats would also be redesignated as training submarines.
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D

Denis_469

New Member
bd popeye said:
Huh? Do you have some proof to back up that statement? And Japan's navy has not been called the IJN for over 65 years...It's the Japanese maritime Self Defence Force.

Here's some info on the Japanese Harushio class sub. I don't think Argentina will get any of these subs. No way.
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Yes, of course.
SS-583 - commisioned 1990, decomissioned 2009. Live is 19 year.
SS-584 - commisioned 1991, decomissioned 2010. Live is 19 year.
SS-585 - commisioned 1992, decomissioned 2011. Live is 19 year.
SS-586 - commisioned 1993, decomissioned 2012. Live is 19 year.

Type "Yushio" (before "Harushio") have live from 17 (SS-582) to 21 year (SS-579).

About JMSDF I know, but really it is IJN.
 
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bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Thanks.^^^. but honestly I think the decommissioning of those boats has more to do with budgetary constraints than the quality of the build.

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About JMSDF I know, but really it is IJN.
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The JMSDF is NOT the IJN. Henceforth refrain from calling the JMSDF the IJN. Read the forum rules before you post again.

[h=3]FORUM RULES: Things to Remember Before Posting, important, please read![/h]

bd popeye super moderator
 
D

Denis_469

New Member
bd popeye said:
Thanks.^^^. but honestly I think the decommissioning of those boats has more to do with budgetary constraints than the quality of the build.
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Decomissioned was so building was too poor. As say in Russia: our boats need more time for enter in level high cost for 1 boat and poor quality building boats. Really now japanese submarine have level USSR 1938 year as quality building.

I know one only country who wish buy japanese submarine. This country is Australia. So Australia is embargoed main submarine sellers like Russia, German and France. Australia not wish buy Sweden submarines so Collins was Sweden. From DPRK Australia can not buy like. German type 214 is poor and France Scorpene poor like. So Australia can not buy this submarine. And France and Germane not too wish sell subs to Australia. Russian submarines Australia can not buy in political reasons. Spain not have working submarines, so Australia not wish buy wet project after experience with Collins. In China Australia can not byu submarines for political reasons.
And so Australia really can not buy russian submarines and have poorly variants from western counterparts, so Australia wish buy japanes submarines. Japan not sell submarines before and in Australia not know about poor quality submarines.
In Russia says that poorely submarines is japanese in whole world. It is certain quality biulding submarines, but nor design, sensors and weapons.
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Link delete so I not have 10 posts in this site. I can not answer with links.
 
asif iqbal

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
whoever said that Japan can even export weapons?

Japanese constitution does not allow for weapons exports let alone Submarines, but landing craft, transports, cargos, etc are allowed

someone correct me, but since 1967 Japan has never sold any weapons, only deal was for F-104 starfighter to Taiwan but that was under US agreement and Japan acted as middle country so somehow they managed to side step the law

and Japanese submarines are certainly not "poor" qaulity i have no idea where that is coming from
 
D

Denis_469

New Member
In Japan constitution not work total:
Export from Japan from 1970 to 1991:
Bangladesh 1 Khan Jahan Ali Tanker (1982) 1983 1
China 3 Jinhou Tanker (1987) 1989-1990 (3)
Dominican Republic (1) MU-2 Light transport ac (1985) 1985 (1) No. could be 3; supplier uncertain, MU-2J version
Gabon 2 YS-11A Transport aircraft (1968) 1971 2 Incl for civilian use
Iran 5 Iran Ajr Landing ship (1978) 1980 5 Officially delivered for civil use but taken over by Navy
Myanmar 2 Sinde Landing craft (1975) 1978 2
Philippines 2 Tirad Pass Patrol craft (1973) 1974 2 'War Reparations Programme' (for WW-2) aid; for coast guard
3 LCU-1466 Landing craft 1975 1979 3 Ex-Japanese; modernized before delivery
3 LST-1 Landing ship 1978 1979 3 Ex-Japanese; modernized before delivery
Sierra Leone 3 Pompoli Landing craft (1978) 1980 3
Sweden (10) MU-2 Light transport ac (1983) 1985 (10) For target-towing and EW training; operated by civilian company for Swedish armed forces
Taiwan (17) F-104G Starfighter FGA aircraft (1985) 1986 (17) Ex-Japanese; F-104J version
(5) F-104G Starfighter FGA aircraft 1985 1986 (5) Ex-Japanese; F-104DJ version

And after 1991 year Japan like made export weapons and armaments.

P.S.: landing ships is warships like.
 
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