ArjunMk1 said:
You hit it. I was speaking about the other AA suite that will follow your armor...SPAAG/SPAAM not about the AA gun on tank.
Significance of the Al Khalid
- Thread starter crazyinsane105
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You hit it. I was speaking about the other AA suite that will follow your armor...SPAAG/SPAAM not about the AA gun on tank.
FreeAsia2000
Junior Member
Why don't tanks have anti-aircraft missiles ? Besides what use is a
AA gun against a Warthog ?
AA gun against a Warthog ?
Ohh my mistake....Well as i stated before Pakistan lacks completly medium/short range AAMs assigned to mobile units. Those MANPADS cannot be sufficient enough for any sort of stratecigal offensive movments (nor are they insufficient for defencive purposes as well) AAA selfpropelled or not wihtout target aqustion radars are pretty much as usefull as AA MGs on tanks...slightly better changes to actually hitting something, but mainly used for harrashing enemy planes than bringing them down...
FreeAsia2000
Junior Member
Gollevainen said:
Isn't the Anza Mk3 a medium range AAM ?
I thought the whole point of MANPADS was to force aircraft to go to ranges
where they could be acquired by radar ?
In any case how effective is AA MGs against a warthog type tankbuster ?
FreeAsia2000 said:
Anzas are only manpads !! They are IR guided .
I almost forgot , India has also OSA AKM and Strela-10M3 mobile missile launchers !!!
Actually Tank m/c guns are good against low flying choppers and even UAVs !! An anti helicopter round has been developed for Arjun tanks , now Russians may also have got such thing for their T-90/72s !!!
FreeAsia2000 said:
I think if you pit another 7 barrel 30 mm gatling gun (like the LD 2000 system) against an A-10, whoever shoots first will probably shred the other to pieces:
A MBT's job is to kill other armored vehicles, so the platform is optimized for that role. Usually they'd depend on dedicated anti-aircraft units for protection. Here's a PZA Loara AA platform based on the T-72 chasis:
There are some exceptions, like the Slovakian T-72M1 with 2x 20mm AA guns:
But if you compare the 2, I think you'd agree that the PZA Loara, a dedicated AA platform with 2 radars that can track 64 aerial targets, would do a better job at shooting down enemy air units.
Here's another interesting one, I think it's Finnish (Gollevainen can prolly verify) - the ItPsv 90 Marksman AA platform:
The platform consists of a Polish T-55 chasis, UK-made turret, and Swiss 35mm Oerlikon guns. Interesting mix of Eastern and Western technology.
yeah the ItPSv 90 marskman...nice thing, one of my friend served in the amoured AA battalion that the things are assigned...
FreeAsia2000
Junior Member
Gollevainen said:
How much do they cost and how effective ?
well for cost im not sure, but the thing was kinda bargain as the hulls came as scrap metal prices from poland...but the things is as effective as any radar controlled 35mm SPAAG, Im not certain wheter we use 3P ammunition in these but still...
IMO the Finnish tank conversion is a very ingenuous use of old T-54/T-55 chasis. The Israelis are also masters at this. They have a lot of old US made M113 APC's and captured T-54/T-55 tanks, and found that the M113's could be destroyed by a RPG round. So they converted the T-54/T-55's to APC's:
And the M113 APC's to air defense units:
The M113 was originally armed with just a machinegun. They replaced it with a 20mm Volcan gun, EL/M 2106 radar, and 4xSAM launcher box.
The General Dynamics 20mm Vulcan gun can fire at rate of 3,000 rounds/min. Armed with APDS rounds, it has an effective range of up to 3.5km.
=====
So the original question was Pakistani's ground force's anti-air capability. According to Pakistani defense web site, Pakistani has over 850 M-113P with local manufacturing facility:
Plus pending order for up to 2,000 "Talha" APC's by 2010:
IMO there's no reason why they cannot copy Israeli concept and convert some APC's to short-range anti-air units. They can purchase technology from the PRC, such as those used on the TY-90:
Just add some AA guns to it and you're good to go.
========
Here's one more T-55 tank conversion (recycled chasis?) from Poland:
The S-125/Newa SC replaces old SA-3 system with updated digital electronics, and mount the missile launcher on a T-55 chasis.
Yugoslavia was known to operate 14 SA-3 batteires with ~60 launchers, credited with a F-117 downing.
And the M113 APC's to air defense units:
The M113 was originally armed with just a machinegun. They replaced it with a 20mm Volcan gun, EL/M 2106 radar, and 4xSAM launcher box.
The General Dynamics 20mm Vulcan gun can fire at rate of 3,000 rounds/min. Armed with APDS rounds, it has an effective range of up to 3.5km.
=====
So the original question was Pakistani's ground force's anti-air capability. According to Pakistani defense web site, Pakistani has over 850 M-113P with local manufacturing facility:
Plus pending order for up to 2,000 "Talha" APC's by 2010:
IMO there's no reason why they cannot copy Israeli concept and convert some APC's to short-range anti-air units. They can purchase technology from the PRC, such as those used on the TY-90:
Just add some AA guns to it and you're good to go.
========
Here's one more T-55 tank conversion (recycled chasis?) from Poland:
The S-125/Newa SC replaces old SA-3 system with updated digital electronics, and mount the missile launcher on a T-55 chasis.
Yugoslavia was known to operate 14 SA-3 batteires with ~60 launchers, credited with a F-117 downing.
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