Returning Turtles

Obcession said:

All of which you said is true. Let's leave the more serious topics for another discussion, as you said.

On another note, some more famous turtles that I know of:

Sun Yat-sen/Sun Zhong Shan - father of the nation, moved to US at 13, then travelled back and forth between China, Japan, and US.

Qian Xuesen - father of Chinese rocketry, moved to the US at age 23 to study, moved back to China in 1955 after being a victim of the McCarthy communist witch hunt to work on the Chinese rocketry and space program.

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That two figures are popular... but there are many other unsung heroes... examples... during WWII outbreak, many of the Chinese in Singapore and Malaysia went back to China to fight foreign aggressors, drive trucks for the Chinese troops and the such. Even as of now, many people are moving back to China for various reasons...

And as China grew in term of living standard, welfare and had much more established infrastructure, I am predicting that more will be going back to China in foreseeable future.

I live in the US and know a lot of people of Chinese ancestry, many of them having parents who moved to the US from China. I haven't heard a lot of sentiment in favor of returning (although admittedly its not something I've talked to a lot of people about). Asians in the United States have been wildly successful in terms of finding prosperity, getting educated, etc. and that's why I don't think that in the US we have the same problems with racism towards Chinese or other Asian immigrants that they have in SE Asia. All those dumb "Tea Party" people protest against immigration, but they're talking about Hispanics. Everyone in the US knows that Asians of all ethnicities have been a huge asset to this country's "melting pot".

Finn McCool said:

I live in the US and know a lot of people of Chinese ancestry, many of them having parents who moved to the US from China. I haven't heard a lot of sentiment in favor of returning (although admittedly its not something I've talked to a lot of people about). Asians in the United States have been wildly successful in terms of finding prosperity, getting educated, etc. and that's why I don't think that in the US we have the same problems with racism towards Chinese or other Asian immigrants that they have in SE Asia. All those dumb "Tea Party" people protest against immigration, but they're talking about Hispanics. Everyone in the US knows that Asians of all ethnicities have been a huge asset to this country's "melting pot".

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I would understand that US is basically an immigration society, whereby it accept immigrants from all walks of life, as long as you have a certain skills, unlike some of the SE Asia countries.

As to whether people wanted to go back to China or not... well... I as far as I know, Chinese are a group of people who seriously keep many of their sentiments to themselves and are not vocal about it. Maybe they wanted to go back to China, but they sure are not speaking out... that is the case for some of the older generation people in Singapore that I know, they wanted to go back... but they do not want to tell others about it unless you are very very close to them.

siegecrossbow said:

A private question Icloo: Are you a Malaysian Chinese?

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Yes, I am. My grand parents and my mother were from China, my father was born in Singapore.

Just wondering though, almost all the Indonesians I've met in Canada are Indonesian Chinese. Is it because of the way native Indonesians treat Indonesian Chinese that they choose to migrate overseas?

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Hmm? You live in Calgary and goes to Waterloo, right? They represent that much of the Chinese over there? I know Calgary isn't a well known city to most Chinese who's never been there, and there's Kristin Kreuk, but almost every Chinese you've met?

sumdud said:

Hmm? You live in Calgary and goes to Waterloo, right? They represent that much of the Chinese over there? I know Calgary isn't a well known city to most Chinese who's never been there, and there's Kristin Kreuk, but almost every Chinese you've met?

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You've misread my post sumdud, I mean all the Indonesians I've come across

Finn McCool said:

I live in the US and know a lot of people of Chinese ancestry, many of them having parents who moved to the US from China. I haven't heard a lot of sentiment in favor of returning (although admittedly its not something I've talked to a lot of people about). Asians in the United States have been wildly successful in terms of finding prosperity, getting educated, etc. and that's why I don't think that in the US we have the same problems with racism towards Chinese or other Asian immigrants that they have in SE Asia. All those dumb "Tea Party" people protest against immigration, but they're talking about Hispanics. Everyone in the US knows that Asians of all ethnicities have been a huge asset to this country's "melting pot".

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They are talking about illegal immigrants which are mostly hispanic. The tea party like any thing new also attracts a lot of crack pots.

Obcession said:

I heartily respect and admire your decision.

Just wondering though, almost all the Indonesians I've met in Canada are Indonesian Chinese. Is it because of the way native Indonesians treat Indonesian Chinese that they choose to migrate overseas?

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Its no surprise to see so many indonesian chinese in Canada. Many stayed after they finish their education there. Who can blame them from moving out of a Indonesian hell hole and move to Canadian paradise.

Those that return to Indonesia return because of lack of job in Canada or continue the family business of exploitation and corruption. But again, you cannot be the good guy even if you choose to in Indonesia. The corrupt government officials forces you to be corrupt, even the church and mosque are corrupt businesses. Its a free for all exploitation slugfest overthere. For those that doubt this, please check the rescent gas drilling incident near Surabaya. The accident cause mud to spew out continuously and already drown an entire city (thankfully without casualty) and it soon will swallow Surabaya, the second largest city in Indonesia. No one is paying the thousands of victims who lost their home to corruption and blunder,

Only Chinese can care about chinese, no one else will. We ought to stand in solidarity and fight for our place in this world that has no pity for us. Not saying that we should start a war and rough up everyone that have bullied us, but we should gain influence, raise awareness and fight for equality and right peacefully so that those attrocities will never happen again.

Quickie said:

The ethnic Chinese in Indonesia suffered the most during the country's last major political upheaval. It's too insensitive to mention the details here. Their crime is for being hard working and end up being more well-to-do than the "natives". Sadly this always seems to be the problem for ethnic Chinese living in a few south east Asian countries although the truth is they - rich or poor - have no choice but to work hard in order to make a living as the affirmative policies in these countries are entirely for the natives only.

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When I was still living in Indonesia, Chinese cannot be any professional except for being a businessman. This force the chinese to develop extremely business oriented mindset and culture. Who can blame us for getting rich? Untill today, Malaysia still protects their majority natives, giving them many economic incentives and does not protect the minority chinese and indians. What kind f country protect their majority instead of minority. speechless...

Things are better for the chinese in Indonesia rescently. This is because the economic prosperity of Indonesia is tied to the well being of Chinese market. They cannot expect to bully local Indonesian chinese and expect no political and economic fallout. with out these reliance, any recession will be used as an excuse by local to start punishing overseas chinese as racial tension is still lingering. THis proves my point that stronger china is better for the majority of overseas chinese.

rhino123 said:

I would understand that US is basically an immigration society, whereby it accept immigrants from all walks of life, as long as you have a certain skills, unlike some of the SE Asia countries.

As to whether people wanted to go back to China or not... well... I as far as I know, Chinese are a group of people who seriously keep many of their sentiments to themselves and are not vocal about it. Maybe they wanted to go back to China, but they sure are not speaking out... that is the case for some of the older generation people in Singapore that I know, they wanted to go back... but they do not want to tell others about it unless you are very very close to them.

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Actually most of the younger generations don't want to go back to china because they are used to their new homeland and also somewhat brainwashed by either the local propaganda or western propaganda that vilify China. Some of them have comfortable elitist life and sees no reason to go back when making money is so easy in whereever they are staying. The problem is these overseas chinese claim that they are local, yet the local still see them as chinese no matter if their great great grand father is born locally. When there is social tension, the minority will take the fall first.

I am one of those rare exception out there among 3rd generation overseas chinese who do not identify the birth nation as the homeland and still pledge commitment and loyalty to China.