PLAN's Lack of sufficient helicopters...an issue?
- Thread starter chicket9
- Start date
I'm not sure about that part. I thought China was engaged with this donation race against Taiwan. It was only worried about offering more to the tsunami-devastated countries than Taiwan. Kind of pathetic actually, if you think how much smaller Taiwan is. However, if we look it from another angle, it was probably the first time in the history that China actually donated to disaster stricken countries. (consider how poor the country is until pretty much this past decade)
I think the problem was due to the fact that PRC simply did not have the capability to conduct the kind of mission to help these guys. They probably just didn't have the capability to send ships over. They probably had enough resources, but not necessarily the coordination to be able to do so. I mean, the Indians didn't do it either, right? And they were actually closer to the other hit countries.
On a side note, I think PLA would've done a better job at disaster relief than anyone else if their relief team was actually sent there. If you look at the work pla has done in the past in terms of helping out hit areas in China, it's nothing short of spectacular. I mean southern China gets flooded pretty much every year, but they do keep the losses to a minimum.
Anyhow, this is getting a little off track, let me just get back on the lack of helicopters.
According to , 20 AS565 were purchased in the 80s. If that's the case, then the number of 26 should be more accurate. Also according to , there are 10 identified ka-28.
INVENTORY
* East Sea Fleet: 9124, 9134, 9144, 9154, 9164, 9174, 9184
* South Sea Fleet: 9664, 9666, 9454
That means 7 are planned with the 136, 137, 138, 139, 525, 526 and 3 are planned with 167, 168, 169, 170, 171. I guess that means more are needed for the south fleet (probably needs 6-8 in total) . East fleet doesn't see to be doing as badly with 7 for 6 ships.
Another article on this:
I think the problem was due to the fact that PRC simply did not have the capability to conduct the kind of mission to help these guys. They probably just didn't have the capability to send ships over. They probably had enough resources, but not necessarily the coordination to be able to do so. I mean, the Indians didn't do it either, right? And they were actually closer to the other hit countries.
On a side note, I think PLA would've done a better job at disaster relief than anyone else if their relief team was actually sent there. If you look at the work pla has done in the past in terms of helping out hit areas in China, it's nothing short of spectacular. I mean southern China gets flooded pretty much every year, but they do keep the losses to a minimum.
Anyhow, this is getting a little off track, let me just get back on the lack of helicopters.
According to , 20 AS565 were purchased in the 80s. If that's the case, then the number of 26 should be more accurate. Also according to , there are 10 identified ka-28.
INVENTORY
* East Sea Fleet: 9124, 9134, 9144, 9154, 9164, 9174, 9184
* South Sea Fleet: 9664, 9666, 9454
That means 7 are planned with the 136, 137, 138, 139, 525, 526 and 3 are planned with 167, 168, 169, 170, 171. I guess that means more are needed for the south fleet (probably needs 6-8 in total) . East fleet doesn't see to be doing as badly with 7 for 6 ships.
Another article on this:
Who knows?
That's right who knows?? I do know this the PLAN better get to steppin' and get some modern helos for ASW and SAR missions. I wonder how many PLAN sailors have been lost at sea because no SAR helo was available? Sailors do fall overboard ya' know. Wait a minute!!..the number of the lost maybe small because as best as I can establish the PLAN ships only spend limited amount of time at sea a year. But the loss of one sailors life is too many
Maybe one of these types is for sale.
Maybe one of these types is for sale.
MIGleader said:
Miggy,I realize that. I was being facisious. I was just trying to piont out that the PLAN needs something! What I should have said is the same thing you have...."the Plan has to get more helicopters if it wants to keep building destroyers"..They just simply have too if they want a viable force.
To bad the Eruo embargo is still in effect. If it were ever lifted the PLA fans and China watchers would be happy.
Hey... if the embargo were lifted what should the PLAN purchase for an ASW/SAR helo?
assuming we are looking at the EADSbd popeye said:
The possible selections are:
Fennec - AS-555SN - payload not enough, maximum takeoff is only 2250 kg
Panther - AS-565MB - basically Z-9C is based on this - Again, the payload is not really adequate. That's why we have been complaining about it in the first place.
Cougar - AS-532SC
NH-90NFH - my personal favourite
EH90 would be an absolute favourite, and only if that embargo was lifted, perhaps PLA would get some too, and a joint production agreement may come across.
But somehow, I don't think China would do that. With an increasing priority in indigenous developments, I think the closest EADS will come is cooperation in Z-10 or Z-15 projects.
I can't wait till Z-10 and Z-15 get off the ground in terms of being transport and naval helicopters. THey will probably still fall short of S-70 Blackhawk and definitely fall short of EH90, but they would have more power, endurance and flexibility than Z-9.
But somehow, I don't think China would do that. With an increasing priority in indigenous developments, I think the closest EADS will come is cooperation in Z-10 or Z-15 projects.
I can't wait till Z-10 and Z-15 get off the ground in terms of being transport and naval helicopters. THey will probably still fall short of S-70 Blackhawk and definitely fall short of EH90, but they would have more power, endurance and flexibility than Z-9.
they may not be as powerful as NH-90, but the technology used on them (well at least Z-15) should be newer. I would think Eurocopter would put the latest technology on this thing. Whatever we want to say about Z-9 series, it's an old platform. It may be China's most successful helicopter program, but it's still ancient.chicket9 said:
In addition to the thing about humanitarian aid etc...
I think China, in terms of coatal humanitarian capabilities...is quite capable.
The Sichang for example is a multipurpose vessel capable of handling two helicopters. Its deck space enables it to carry much aid on board as well.
The Yuting and Yuting II, of which 20 are in service with more expected, each have a deck claimed to support two medium helicopters. THese LSTs also carry the LCVP, of course nothing comparing to USN LCVPs, but at least they can ferry quick personnel or priority supplies quickly to shallow coasts.
In addition, you got the large number of amphibious warfare ships and auxilaries capable of partaking in humanitarian aids around the coast.
Ships like the Yutings and Sichang, if needed, could have operated in the Tsunami region, if supported by ports and tankers. Of course, the reason why China didnt get involve more is something worth debating about (in another thread though).
In addition to more helicopters, I think PLAN should build another one or two ships similar to Sichang for aviation support. Sichang has shown great usefulness for humanitarian, cargo freighting, aviation training, military lift, and recently, able to carry the Type 22XX stealthy catamaran. The current vessel I believe is doing very well, but has too many roles to perform considering it is the only vessel of its type in Chinese service.
The LPH may help, but I got a feeling that would be reserved for more combatant operations than pure training or lifting. Therefore perhaps an improved or enlarged design based on the Sichang should be built.
I think China, in terms of coatal humanitarian capabilities...is quite capable.
The Sichang for example is a multipurpose vessel capable of handling two helicopters. Its deck space enables it to carry much aid on board as well.
The Yuting and Yuting II, of which 20 are in service with more expected, each have a deck claimed to support two medium helicopters. THese LSTs also carry the LCVP, of course nothing comparing to USN LCVPs, but at least they can ferry quick personnel or priority supplies quickly to shallow coasts.
In addition, you got the large number of amphibious warfare ships and auxilaries capable of partaking in humanitarian aids around the coast.
Ships like the Yutings and Sichang, if needed, could have operated in the Tsunami region, if supported by ports and tankers. Of course, the reason why China didnt get involve more is something worth debating about (in another thread though).
In addition to more helicopters, I think PLAN should build another one or two ships similar to Sichang for aviation support. Sichang has shown great usefulness for humanitarian, cargo freighting, aviation training, military lift, and recently, able to carry the Type 22XX stealthy catamaran. The current vessel I believe is doing very well, but has too many roles to perform considering it is the only vessel of its type in Chinese service.
The LPH may help, but I got a feeling that would be reserved for more combatant operations than pure training or lifting. Therefore perhaps an improved or enlarged design based on the Sichang should be built.