PLAN Type 035/039/091/092 Submarine Thread

[kroko]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

That's like asking why an SSBN needs torpedo hatches... self defense of course.

Now while I do not believe this sub is necessarily an SSB or a test sub, it's not inconceivable. We have no idea how advanced this submarine is, and goodness knows it might not only be used for testing ballistic missiles but also torpedos (which gives necessity for torpedo hatches). IF this is replacing the aged golf, it makes sense for it to be modern enough to accomodate future modifications

If they wanted a submarine to teste weapons, why not convert a single song or yuan for it, instead of developing a entirely new class just for it? It just doesnt make sense.

 

[plawolf]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

I also highly doubt that this is a missile testbed. This boat is far too refined for that.

I wonder if the huge sail is used to house extra batteries/fuel cells or some new experimental AIP system. This boat certainly looks big enough to be ocean going, and they would need to significantly extend the length of time/range SSKs can travel on batteries/AIP for the sub to be of much use far from home.

I just had a bit of a crazy idea looking at the sub, could the top opening be to allow access to a removable battery/fuel cell unit?

The sub would run silently on batteries/fuel cells, and meet up with a sub tender when its running low on juice. The sail opens and the tender swops the spent battery/fuel cell for a fresh one. The sub is good to go again in maybe less than an hour, without making any noise, and then the sub tender uses its own generators to charge up the spent battery/fuel cell so it's ready when the sub needs another battery change.

 

[zoom]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Then all you would need to do is track the tender, defeating the purpose of the stealth sub.

 

[Blitzo]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

If they wanted a submarine to teste weapons, why not convert a single song or yuan for it, instead of developing a entirely new class just for it? It just doesnt make sense.

If it was to test ballistic missiles (in addition to other technology and weapons) a song or yuan wouldn't be big enough.

I also highly doubt that this is a missile testbed. This boat is far too refined for that.

I'm also not too sure about how "refined" this submarine is... Let's say PLAN were to hypothetically build a new sub purely as a test bed for new technology -- I imagine it would still look quite refined and incorporate some better stealth shaping, and not some old, worn out design.
Again personally I don't have an opinion on what this submarine (still a mystery two years since it came out) is, but there's nothing definitively condemning its potential role as a testbed.

 

[plawolf]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Then all you would need to do is track the tender, defeating the purpose of the stealth sub.

Not as easy as you might think. After all, the USN's primary defense for their carriers is being undetectable. If an entire carrier strike group can 'disappear' in the oceans and be a pain to find, how much more difficult would the task be trying to find a single sub tender?

 

[plawolf]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

I'm also not too sure about how "refined" this submarine is... Let's say PLAN were to hypothetically build a new sub purely as a test bed for new technology -- I imagine it would still look quite refined and incorporate some better stealth shaping, and not some old, worn out design.

Again personally I don't have an opinion on what this submarine (still a mystery two years since it came out) is, but there's nothing definitively condemning its potential role as a testbed.

Why would be a ballistic missile testbed care about stealth shaping?

If its for testing, its best to test the system 'as is', so the best result would be if they just slapped a 2 cell ballistic missile VLS from the 094 class directly onto this sub. So what if it looks hideous, is draggy as hell and loud as a rock concert?

A ballistic missile test boat is not meant to see combat, its only purpose is to test ballistic missiles, so it would make sense that all other concerns come secondary.

The fact that they bothered to make the design stealthy and streamlined, and that there is no obvious recognizable missile hatches would make it unlikely that it is a SSB.

I remember when the 022 first came out, loads of people were suggesting that it was a scale model for a much larger boat.

I was sure that the 022 was an operational design for the same reasons I feel that this is one as well - too much attention has been paid to operationally relevant details for this to be a purely experimental exercise. You just don't waste the time, effort and money on such things unless you intend to use it operationally.

 

[Blitzo]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

^ Well I did say test bed for new technology in general. Like it could have space for testing of VLS and other tech like the PLAN's test vessel which we've seen with new radars and HQ-10 being fitted on etc.
(and for the record I believe there was a "downsized" 022 which was launched first and probably acted as a "tech demonstrator")

wrt the stealthy design -- there's a good chance the investment into this submarine's shaping could be applied to a real class of SSKs.

I remain unsure of what this sub could be for, but I wouldn't rule out the idea that it can be a dedicated test boat.

 

[Engineer]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

There was a picture of a submarine model floating around few years ago. The sail on that model resembles the one on the Akula class. Does anybody know what I am talking about?

 

[Spartan95]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Not as easy as you might think. After all, the USN's primary defense for their carriers is being undetectable. If an entire carrier strike group can 'disappear' in the oceans and be a pain to find, how much more difficult would the task be trying to find a single sub tender?

Well, the Allies were able to hunt German sub tenders in both World Wars quite well. Which was why the Germans developed snorkeling to recharge their batteries, so that they no longer need tenders.

The next evolution should be to remove the need to snorkel at all (i.e., AIP).

 

[kroko]

Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

^ Well I did say test bed for new technology in general. Like it could have space for testing of VLS and other tech like the PLAN's test vessel which we've seen with new radars and HQ-10 being fitted on etc.
(and for the record I believe there was a "downsized" 022 which was launched first and probably acted as a "tech demonstrator")

wrt the stealthy design -- there's a good chance the investment into this submarine's shaping could be applied to a real class of SSKs.

I remain unsure of what this sub could be for, but I wouldn't rule out the idea that it can be a dedicated test boat.

Theoretically its possible, but probably not. A submarine is not a surface vessel. its more expensive and complex to build.