PLAN Sovremenny DDG 136, 137, 138 & 139 Thread
- Thread starter FarkTypeSoldier
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MwRYum
Major
If it's true that they pack a 8-cell univeral VLS module there, that means a very serious upgrade in terms of firepower, as many as 8 LACM can be packed onboard.
If it really does have an 8 cell universal VLS there (and tbh I doubt the real thing will), it gives the ship greater flexibility but I wouldn't say it is that great of an increase in firepower.
I imagine the only viable weapons they could fit are LACM and AShM as they would not require the sort of extensive sensor fit that newer SAMs would need. I suppose they could also be equipped with larger VL ASROC type weapons as well.
But with only 8 VLS I'm not really sure what the most optimal use of it would be. 8 LACMs would be useful and I suppose it could contribute a little to the overall LACM throw weight of a task force composed of other 052Ds and 055s but 8 LACMs by themselves probably won't do much.
8 AShMs like YJ-12 could do a good job of complementing the 8 expected YJ-12s and further emphasize the ship's original role as an anti surface platform, but then again the VLS is universal so there's no reason why they'd have to necessarily give it YJ-18s.
I think if they can equip it with a new heavy weight VL ASROC weapon (like a VL version of the ASROC fired from YJ-83 canisters) then that could be quite useful to the Sovs and provide them significantly greater ASW capability. The 32 054A VLS they are alraedy equipped with would allow them to fire the smaller model VL ASROC that is also fitted to 054A, but I think having a longer ranged and heavier VL ASROC weapon could be quite beneficial and allow them to preserve more of their 32 054A VLS for actual HHQ-16 rounds instead.
I have a feeling it's going to be two YJ-18 quad launchers at the flanks. Whereas we've seen plenty of photos of YJ-18 slant launchers, I doubt any of us have seen photos of YJ-12 slant launchers, especially since YJ-12 has been developed as an air-dropped weapon and the large launchers required for their diameters would be easily distinguishable.
As for "larger" VL ASROC-type weapons, the universal VLS really makes it hard to judge size, that is unless you witness it immediately out of its tube or know at least know its method of launch, since hot launch will invariably require thinner missiles. So having a universal VLS does really automatically imply a larger missile just because it is a large tube; you have to know whether it is hot or cold launch.
Hmm have we seen any confirmed photos of YJ-18 slant launchers?
I don't think we have, and tbh I don't think any of us have even seen a confirmed photo of just what YJ-18 actually even looks like. The closest thing we have for YJ-18 is this () video clip of a hot launch CCL missile from the navy's test ship a few years ago, that was widely thought to be YJ-18, but it's launched so fast and we only see the beginning of it and maybe the end of it, such that we don't know what it actually looks like. The YJ-18, after all these years is still actually quite a mysterious missile.
OTOH, for YJ-12, we know that its export variant (CM-302) been test fired from a slant launcher of some kind, so I wouldn't say it is a surprise that the domestic YJ-12 may have slant canisters for ships.
I think we know how big the universal VLS dimensions are, the issue is whether the VL ASROC is small enough to fit in there (in terms of folded width -- I think length shouldn't be much of an issue for the 9m version and maybe even the 7m version), and whether the venting system is sufficient for CCL hot launch or whether it needs to be expelled out for cold launch.
"Confirmed"? No, but we know what YJ-18 launchers look like. They look like this:
These slant launchers don't make sense holding missiles other than YJ-18 (e.g. CJ-10, YJ-83, etc.) since on the 051B they are almost certainly replacements for the YJ-83, making LACMs unlikely. The chance that the YJ-83 itself somehow got a new canister also seems unlikely. It would also seem odd if multiple new ships are utilizing multiple new ASCMs; most likely they would all consolidate into the YJ-18 platform, either slant- or vertical-launched. These reasons IMO make it highly likely that all 3 photos here house the same YJ-18 missile.
There are probably multiple "VL ASROC" missile types out there, including possibly the latest one with the foldout fins. My point is that not knowing their exact dimensions and launch method options makes it literally impossible to know if they will fit into a universal tube or not, regardless of whether we know the internal dimensions of the universal tube.
I'm familiar with those canister photos, but i thought they were canisters for YJ-12 rather than YJ-18..
Oh yes, that is true, no disagreement with that.
A YJ-12 canister would look much closer to what a Sunburn canister looks like, since both of these missiles are much closer in shape and size to each other than to a YJ-18, which by the brief appearances it has made looks much more like a Klub, especially the 3M54E variant:
Hmm i see no reason why we should expect YJ-12s canister to be round just because it has a similar configuration to Moskit. I think there is just as sensible to think it could be square.
One only needs to think about all the Harpoon, Exocet, YJ-83 variants etc with similar configuration with the array of canister cross sections they come in.
I mean, it's definitely possible the canisters could be for YJ-18 but i think it is just as reasonable to suggest it could be for YJ-12
Regardless of whether it's round, it will certainly be MUCH larger in size than a canister for YJ-18 given its quadruple air intakes. I suspect it will be fairly obviously if and when we finally do see a YJ-12 canister that it is in fact a YJ-12 canister.