PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

King_Comm said:

If a 35 tonne catapult can be built, then Su-33 will be far superior to any other carrier based aircraft out there.

Click to expand...

I do not agree. The Super Hornet will certainly more than give it a run for its money, and the Rafale is not far behind, if at all.

There is much more to air dominance from a carrier than the fighter platform itself, though that platform does need the range, performance, and agility necessary to engage one on one...but there is more that the Russians and others will not be able to couple with the SU-33. A strong AEW platform and the datalinks thereto to guide such aircraft onto target and control their weapons without them having to emit. Strong EW capabilities associated with either strike packages or fleet defense like the Prowler and Growler aircraft provied.

The technological capabilities, and quality and dependability of their weapons, particularly their BVR missiles.

All of these combine to add to the effectiveness of the fighter platform itself and in many of these areas, the super hornet will have the decided advantage.

Do not get me wrong, the SU-33 is a great aircraft, but in order to be far superior to any other aircraft out there, it has to have these other capabilities supporting it.

Just my opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

King_Comm said:

If a 35 tonne catapult can be built, then Su-33 will be far superior to any other carrier based aircraft out there.

Click to expand...

I do not agree. The Super Hornet will certainly more than give it a run for its money, and the Rafale is not far behind, if at all.

There is much more to air dominance from a carrier than the fighter platform itself, though that platform does need the range, performance, and agility necessary to engage one on one...but there is more that the Russians and others will not be able to couple with the SU-33. A strong AEW platform and the datalinks thereto to guide such aircraft onto target and control their weapons without them having to emit. Strong EW capabilities associated with either strike packages or fleet defense like the Prowler and Growler aircraft provied.

The technological capabilities, and quality and dependability of their weapons, particularly their BVR missiles.

All of these combine to add to the effectiveness of the fighter platform itself and in many of these areas, the super hornet will have the decided advantage.

Do not get me wrong, the SU-33 is a great aircraft, but in order to be far superior to any other aircraft out there, it has to have these other capabilities supporting it.

Just my opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

King_Comm said:

If a 35 tonne catapult can be built, then Su-33 will be far superior to any other carrier based aircraft out there.

Click to expand...

I do not agree. The Super Hornet will certainly more than give it a run for its money, and the Rafale is not far behind, if at all.

There is much more to air dominance from a carrier than the fighter platform itself, though that platform does need the range, performance, and agility necessary to engage one on one...but there is more that the Russians and others will not be able to couple with the SU-33. A strong AEW platform and the datalinks thereto to guide such aircraft onto target and control their weapons without them having to emit. Strong EW capabilities associated with either strike packages or fleet defense like the Prowler and Growler aircraft provied.

The technological capabilities, and quality and dependability of their weapons, particularly their BVR missiles.

All of these combine to add to the effectiveness of the fighter platform itself and in many of these areas, the super hornet will have the decided advantage.

Do not get me wrong, the SU-33 is a great aircraft, but in order to be far superior to any other aircraft out there, it has to have these other capabilities supporting it.

Just my opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

bd popeye said:

...do you think the Varyag will ever be operational?? In any mode..either training or operational? If so what will become of the Varyag??

Click to expand...

Popeye, I still believe the VAryag will be activated and commissioned as an operational PLAN vessel.

Too much work, too much upgrading. If they did not absolutely intend it, there would never have been any reason whatsoever to put that non-skid primer on and then cover it with the non-skid surface. That was expensive and completely un-necessary if the vessel was not intended to embark aircraft at sea.

Same for all the logistics facilities around the Varyag which remain in place.

I believe interior work is going on and that within a year to 18 months that we will see something substanitive from her.

If nothing occurs by then, I may well come off my own predictions...but until then, the PLAN has simply spent too much money on activities that are far beyond "studying" the Varyag and I do not believe they intend to waste all that money and time.

But, as always, that is simply my own opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

bd popeye said:

...do you think the Varyag will ever be operational?? In any mode..either training or operational? If so what will become of the Varyag??

Click to expand...

Popeye, I still believe the VAryag will be activated and commissioned as an operational PLAN vessel.

Too much work, too much upgrading. If they did not absolutely intend it, there would never have been any reason whatsoever to put that non-skid primer on and then cover it with the non-skid surface. That was expensive and completely un-necessary if the vessel was not intended to embark aircraft at sea.

Same for all the logistics facilities around the Varyag which remain in place.

I believe interior work is going on and that within a year to 18 months that we will see something substanitive from her.

If nothing occurs by then, I may well come off my own predictions...but until then, the PLAN has simply spent too much money on activities that are far beyond "studying" the Varyag and I do not believe they intend to waste all that money and time.

But, as always, that is simply my own opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

bd popeye said:

...do you think the Varyag will ever be operational?? In any mode..either training or operational? If so what will become of the Varyag??

Click to expand...

Popeye, I still believe the VAryag will be activated and commissioned as an operational PLAN vessel.

Too much work, too much upgrading. If they did not absolutely intend it, there would never have been any reason whatsoever to put that non-skid primer on and then cover it with the non-skid surface. That was expensive and completely un-necessary if the vessel was not intended to embark aircraft at sea.

Same for all the logistics facilities around the Varyag which remain in place.

I believe interior work is going on and that within a year to 18 months that we will see something substanitive from her.

If nothing occurs by then, I may well come off my own predictions...but until then, the PLAN has simply spent too much money on activities that are far beyond "studying" the Varyag and I do not believe they intend to waste all that money and time.

But, as always, that is simply my own opinion.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

The SU-33 is also handicapped by not being catapult launched, so it is limited in it's payload and range when using the ski jump. If the Russians had fitted the Kuznetzov with cats then they would now be able to fully exploit the potential of the Flanker and that in itself would help close the gap between it and the Hornet; by extension AEW and EW aircraft would also be a possibility for the Russian Navy (the SU-25 Frogfoots would make a good platform for an EW type as things stand).

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

The SU-33 is also handicapped by not being catapult launched, so it is limited in it's payload and range when using the ski jump. If the Russians had fitted the Kuznetzov with cats then they would now be able to fully exploit the potential of the Flanker and that in itself would help close the gap between it and the Hornet; by extension AEW and EW aircraft would also be a possibility for the Russian Navy (the SU-25 Frogfoots would make a good platform for an EW type as things stand).

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

The SU-33 is also handicapped by not being catapult launched, so it is limited in it's payload and range when using the ski jump. If the Russians had fitted the Kuznetzov with cats then they would now be able to fully exploit the potential of the Flanker and that in itself would help close the gap between it and the Hornet; by extension AEW and EW aircraft would also be a possibility for the Russian Navy (the SU-25 Frogfoots would make a good platform for an EW type as things stand).

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

The Su-33 is from same generation as the F-18A/B. There's been various rumored Su-33 upgrades and product brochures, but I have yet to see them in operation.

The current generation of Su-33 is not really comparable to the Super Hornet. But if the upgrades described in these articles materialize, then it'd be a better comparison: