PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

I think this is the crux of the argument. I don't believe this analogy holds up when you increase the scale to thousands of people over several decades. A large military project is a combination of very many skills, and most of these skills have a civilian counterpart. For the ones that don't you 1) hire from other countries, 2) develop the skills with intensive R&D effort, or 3) live with the fact that this particular area (not the whole ship) will be inferior. Even option three isn't the end of the world - nobody said the ship had to be perfect.

Click to expand...

Exactly! I remember when Canada built the city class frigate in the late 80's She completely lost her warship building capability after long hiatus of 25 years There is not a single shipyard that built warship But She still has St John Shipyard that continue building civilian freighter And She still the world leader in process industry Worst ,There is not single company that built military sensor like radar and
fcs but she has thriving industry in supplying Radar to civilian airport.

In no time at all She build brand new shipyard to built naval warship St John hire many british naval designer and skill trade men by boatload.Form a new company to design Naval sensor in cooperation with leading university.The strength of Canadian industry save the day

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

I think this is the crux of the argument. I don't believe this analogy holds up when you increase the scale to thousands of people over several decades. A large military project is a combination of very many skills, and most of these skills have a civilian counterpart. For the ones that don't you 1) hire from other countries, 2) develop the skills with intensive R&D effort, or 3) live with the fact that this particular area (not the whole ship) will be inferior. Even option three isn't the end of the world - nobody said the ship had to be perfect.

Click to expand...

Exactly! I remember when Canada built the city class frigate in the late 80's She completely lost her warship building capability after long hiatus of 25 years There is not a single shipyard that built warship But She still has St John Shipyard that continue building civilian freighter And She still the world leader in process industry Worst ,There is not single company that built military sensor like radar and
fcs but she has thriving industry in supplying Radar to civilian airport.

In no time at all She build brand new shipyard to built naval warship St John hire many british naval designer and skill trade men by boatload.Form a new company to design Naval sensor in cooperation with leading university.The strength of Canadian industry save the day

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Hendrik_2000 said:

Exactly! I remember when Canada built the city class frigate in the late 80's She completely lost her warship building capability after long hiatus of 25 years There is not a single shipyard that built warship But She still has St John Shipyard that continue building civilian freighter And She still the world leader in process industry Worst ,There is not single company that built military sensor like radar and
fcs but she has thriving industry in supplying Radar to civilian airport.

In no time at all She build brand new shipyard to built naval warship St John hire many british naval designer and skill trade men by boatload.Form a new company to design Naval sensor in cooperation with leading university.The strength of Canadian industry save the day

Click to expand...

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Hendrik_2000 said:

Exactly! I remember when Canada built the city class frigate in the late 80's She completely lost her warship building capability after long hiatus of 25 years There is not a single shipyard that built warship But She still has St John Shipyard that continue building civilian freighter And She still the world leader in process industry Worst ,There is not single company that built military sensor like radar and
fcs but she has thriving industry in supplying Radar to civilian airport.

In no time at all She build brand new shipyard to built naval warship St John hire many british naval designer and skill trade men by boatload.Form a new company to design Naval sensor in cooperation with leading university.The strength of Canadian industry save the day

Click to expand...

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Hendrik_2000 said:

Exactly! I remember when Canada built the city class frigate in the late 80's She completely lost her warship building capability after long hiatus of 25 years There is not a single shipyard that built warship But She still has St John Shipyard that continue building civilian freighter And She still the world leader in process industry Worst ,There is not single company that built military sensor like radar and
fcs but she has thriving industry in supplying Radar to civilian airport.

In no time at all She build brand new shipyard to built naval warship St John hire many british naval designer and skill trade men by boatload.Form a new company to design Naval sensor in cooperation with leading university.The strength of Canadian industry save the day

Click to expand...

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

tphuang said:

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Click to expand...

Size doesn't indicate that South Korea is more advance than China.It all depend on customer requirement Once you built a succesfull prototype it doesn't take long to scale up providing that you have big enough shipyard to built it

For your information the city class except it's weapon system and thales radar the majority are mostly domestic design

Doesn't mean that China cannot built 300,000 ton ships here is a news from China daily



China to deliver 1st LNG ship
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2007-02-20 09:06

China has made substantial breakthroughs in shipbuilding as the first liquefied natural gas (LNG) ship made in China, one of the most advanced in the world, will be delivered in September.

Only the Republic of Korea, Japan and a few European countries have acquired the technologies to build such ocean liners.

Since natural gas can only be turned into the liquefied after the temperature dropped below minus 163 degrees Celsius, LNG ships are often dubbed as the "maritime super freezer".

The boat with a capacity of 47,200 cubic meters is under construction by the Hudong-Zhonghua Shipbuilding, a subsidiary of the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC), China's top and the world's third largest shipping group.

Another four such LNG vessels also under construction would be delivered in the end of this year while the research and development for LNG ships with a capacity of 200,000 cubic meters is underway, sources with the CSSC said. The Shanghai Waigaoqiao Shipbuilding Company, one of its subsidiaries, is going to deliver a floating, production, storage and offloading vessel to the United States-headquartered oil giant ConocoPhilips in May.

The vessel with a designed capacity of 300,000 tons is the largest and most costly vessel of its kind in China.

CSSC will also deliver in September a 8,530 TEU container vessel and a dredger with a capacity of 13,500 cubic meters in May, both the largest of its kind in China.

CSSC, parent company of 60 subsidiaries covering ship building, ship repair, research and development and offshore engineering, posted a profit of more than 5 billion yuan last year,

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

tphuang said:

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Click to expand...

Size doesn't indicate that South Korea is more advance than China.It all depend on customer requirement Once you built a succesfull prototype it doesn't take long to scale up providing that you have big enough shipyard to built it

For your information the city class except it's weapon system and thales radar the majority are mostly domestic design

Doesn't mean that China cannot built 300,000 ton ships here is a news from China daily



China to deliver 1st LNG ship
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2007-02-20 09:06

China has made substantial breakthroughs in shipbuilding as the first liquefied natural gas (LNG) ship made in China, one of the most advanced in the world, will be delivered in September.

Only the Republic of Korea, Japan and a few European countries have acquired the technologies to build such ocean liners.

Since natural gas can only be turned into the liquefied after the temperature dropped below minus 163 degrees Celsius, LNG ships are often dubbed as the "maritime super freezer".

The boat with a capacity of 47,200 cubic meters is under construction by the Hudong-Zhonghua Shipbuilding, a subsidiary of the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC), China's top and the world's third largest shipping group.

Another four such LNG vessels also under construction would be delivered in the end of this year while the research and development for LNG ships with a capacity of 200,000 cubic meters is underway, sources with the CSSC said. The Shanghai Waigaoqiao Shipbuilding Company, one of its subsidiaries, is going to deliver a floating, production, storage and offloading vessel to the United States-headquartered oil giant ConocoPhilips in May.

The vessel with a designed capacity of 300,000 tons is the largest and most costly vessel of its kind in China.

CSSC will also deliver in September a 8,530 TEU container vessel and a dredger with a capacity of 13,500 cubic meters in May, both the largest of its kind in China.

CSSC, parent company of 60 subsidiaries covering ship building, ship repair, research and development and offshore engineering, posted a profit of more than 5 billion yuan last year,

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

tphuang said:

You are comparing building a frigate to building a carrier? What would make you think that a shipyard fully capable of building more complex ships can't do a frigate? And yes, they also get plenty of help from other Western countries.

And getting back to LNG carrier, HD has finally completed its first LNG carrier slightly behind schedule. And it's only 147K tonne. That compares to the South Koreans, who regularly build 300K tonne LNG carriers.

This article is slightly optimistic Korean view, but it probably has more truth than you are putting out.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Click to expand...

Size doesn't indicate that South Korea is more advance than China.It all depend on customer requirement Once you built a succesfull prototype it doesn't take long to scale up providing that you have big enough shipyard to built it

For your information the city class except it's weapon system and thales radar the majority are mostly domestic design

Doesn't mean that China cannot built 300,000 ton ships here is a news from China daily



China to deliver 1st LNG ship
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2007-02-20 09:06

China has made substantial breakthroughs in shipbuilding as the first liquefied natural gas (LNG) ship made in China, one of the most advanced in the world, will be delivered in September.

Only the Republic of Korea, Japan and a few European countries have acquired the technologies to build such ocean liners.

Since natural gas can only be turned into the liquefied after the temperature dropped below minus 163 degrees Celsius, LNG ships are often dubbed as the "maritime super freezer".

The boat with a capacity of 47,200 cubic meters is under construction by the Hudong-Zhonghua Shipbuilding, a subsidiary of the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC), China's top and the world's third largest shipping group.

Another four such LNG vessels also under construction would be delivered in the end of this year while the research and development for LNG ships with a capacity of 200,000 cubic meters is underway, sources with the CSSC said. The Shanghai Waigaoqiao Shipbuilding Company, one of its subsidiaries, is going to deliver a floating, production, storage and offloading vessel to the United States-headquartered oil giant ConocoPhilips in May.

The vessel with a designed capacity of 300,000 tons is the largest and most costly vessel of its kind in China.

CSSC will also deliver in September a 8,530 TEU container vessel and a dredger with a capacity of 13,500 cubic meters in May, both the largest of its kind in China.

CSSC, parent company of 60 subsidiaries covering ship building, ship repair, research and development and offshore engineering, posted a profit of more than 5 billion yuan last year,

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Hendrik_2000 said:

Size doesn't indicate that South Korea is more advance than China.It all depend on customer requirement Once you built a succesfull prototype it doesn't take long to scale up providing that you have big enough shipyard to built it

For your information the city class except it's weapon system and thales radar the majority are mostly domestic design

Doesn't mean that China cannot built 300,000 ton ships here is a news from China daily

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China to deliver 1st LNG ship
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2007-02-20 09:06

China has made substantial breakthroughs in shipbuilding as the first liquefied natural gas (LNG) ship made in China, one of the most advanced in the world, will be delivered in September.

Only the Republic of Korea, Japan and a few European countries have acquired the technologies to build such ocean liners.

Since natural gas can only be turned into the liquefied after the temperature dropped below minus 163 degrees Celsius, LNG ships are often dubbed as the "maritime super freezer".

The boat with a capacity of 47,200 cubic meters is under construction by the Hudong-Zhonghua Shipbuilding, a subsidiary of the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC), China's top and the world's third largest shipping group.

Another four such LNG vessels also under construction would be delivered in the end of this year while the research and development for LNG ships with a capacity of 200,000 cubic meters is underway, sources with the CSSC said. The Shanghai Waigaoqiao Shipbuilding Company, one of its subsidiaries, is going to deliver a floating, production, storage and offloading vessel to the United States-headquartered oil giant ConocoPhilips in May.

The vessel with a designed capacity of 300,000 tons is the largest and most costly vessel of its kind in China.

CSSC will also deliver in September a 8,530 TEU container vessel and a dredger with a capacity of 13,500 cubic meters in May, both the largest of its kind in China.

CSSC, parent company of 60 subsidiaries covering ship building, ship repair, research and development and offshore engineering, posted a profit of more than 5 billion yuan last year,

Click to expand...

Again, why would Canada not be able to design a frigate? It's a frigate, it's not a 93000 tonne carrier. I don't even know why you are bringing Canada and a frigate into the discussion. Canada is one of the most technologically advanced country in the world.

Again, as I said, if you think China can be anywhere near South Korea's level with its first LNG carrier, I don't even know how to comment on that. It's like saying Avic-I is at the same level as Boeing/Airbus once ARJ-21 gets delivered.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Hendrik_2000 said:

Size doesn't indicate that South Korea is more advance than China.It all depend on customer requirement Once you built a succesfull prototype it doesn't take long to scale up providing that you have big enough shipyard to built it

For your information the city class except it's weapon system and thales radar the majority are mostly domestic design

Doesn't mean that China cannot built 300,000 ton ships here is a news from China daily

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China to deliver 1st LNG ship
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2007-02-20 09:06

China has made substantial breakthroughs in shipbuilding as the first liquefied natural gas (LNG) ship made in China, one of the most advanced in the world, will be delivered in September.

Only the Republic of Korea, Japan and a few European countries have acquired the technologies to build such ocean liners.

Since natural gas can only be turned into the liquefied after the temperature dropped below minus 163 degrees Celsius, LNG ships are often dubbed as the "maritime super freezer".

The boat with a capacity of 47,200 cubic meters is under construction by the Hudong-Zhonghua Shipbuilding, a subsidiary of the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC), China's top and the world's third largest shipping group.

Another four such LNG vessels also under construction would be delivered in the end of this year while the research and development for LNG ships with a capacity of 200,000 cubic meters is underway, sources with the CSSC said. The Shanghai Waigaoqiao Shipbuilding Company, one of its subsidiaries, is going to deliver a floating, production, storage and offloading vessel to the United States-headquartered oil giant ConocoPhilips in May.

The vessel with a designed capacity of 300,000 tons is the largest and most costly vessel of its kind in China.

CSSC will also deliver in September a 8,530 TEU container vessel and a dredger with a capacity of 13,500 cubic meters in May, both the largest of its kind in China.

CSSC, parent company of 60 subsidiaries covering ship building, ship repair, research and development and offshore engineering, posted a profit of more than 5 billion yuan last year,

Click to expand...

Again, why would Canada not be able to design a frigate? It's a frigate, it's not a 93000 tonne carrier. I don't even know why you are bringing Canada and a frigate into the discussion. Canada is one of the most technologically advanced country in the world.

Again, as I said, if you think China can be anywhere near South Korea's level with its first LNG carrier, I don't even know how to comment on that. It's like saying Avic-I is at the same level as Boeing/Airbus once ARJ-21 gets delivered.