India is the true spiritual successor of the Victorian/Dickensian era British Empire. Is that a case to bring India into UNSC to replace UK as the legitimate "British Empire" seat?
New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) in China
- Thread starter supercat
- Start date
That's not a downside for an economy with 6-7% yoy growth. That's just an opportunity, same way as 90s China for western car brands.
All that huge mass of people growing richer from the floor of 30@1000 car ownership will sooner rather than later become the next major driver of global car demand.
I think it's unlikely BYD will setup shop in Italy in the short term, these kind of decisions involve national government approval. Considering Italy just left BRI and the Italian government didn't have much big meetings with China, this western news doesn't seem realistic. IMO BYD is probably going to build a factory in france, there are many geopolitical reasons why this is favourable, plus the fact that Xi is going to visit France very soon.
I`ve just seen NEVs sales stats for February, what a disastrous free fall, even lower than February last year.
As i said many times, this format of CNY is deadly for the economy, as GDP grows, inpact is getting harder and harder, causing tremendous losses in money, time...
As i said many times, this format of CNY is deadly for the economy, as GDP grows, inpact is getting harder and harder, causing tremendous losses in money, time...
Maybe a BYD powered Tuktok.
The problem isn't that you have difference opinion, but that you are making your point without a full understanding of the industry as a whole.
If they didn't confiscate Huawei, then they won't confiscate BYD. In fact, Huawei continues to have a huge presence in Europe. At worst, BYD will have to sell their factory. But if they do this, all the German companies will have to do it in China also. That would be a great win for BYD.
BYD should not stop in its process of growing in European market, because it is the second largest EV market. It is getting around possible tariffs by building factories locally.
Well, I think when you mix in geopolitics, then discussions get overly emotional. BYD mentioning Italy got blowback here because they left BRI. Now if you mention another country like Spain, Greece or Portugal, it has similar risk factor due to their status as NATO members.
Now if you believe that they shouldn't set up factory in Europe, that's a different discussion. Then, you have risk of getting major tariffs and not selling your EVs. Which is a problem after investing in hundreds to thousands of stores + dealership network. The yearly cost of paying these stores are not any less than depreciation/interest/operating cost of a factory.
Then, if your answer is they shouldn't sell cars in any Western countries, then you are missing out on half of world's auto market. All markets where BYD can sell their EVs at much higher prices.
There is risks in every investment. It's silly to think that BYD is not doing their own geopolitical calculations in these decisions. Stella Li recently said BYD has no plan to enter American PV market. And I think that's the right move. BYD has a politically saavy group of people running. They are doing all they can to reduce geopolitical risks.
Remember, BYD has a huge factory in Lancaster California and is probably the largest supplier of electric commercial vehicles in America. In fact, my city buys from them. And they've operated here for a long time. They are extremely good at navigating these things
Very slow February across the board for EV makers in China. This is like the worst month for BYD for a long time. Everyone is just waiting for the 2024 models to come out. I guess at some point, you shouldn't expect massive price cut for new models, but we are not there, clearly
i think Gavekal made a good point recently about how China's auto market size suddenly exploded in size when per capita gdp elevated to a level where middle class can afford family cars. At some point, a larger portion of Indian families will be able to afford cars. And Chinese EVs are even cheaper than ICE cars now. So there is potential there for a large local market
My overall view is that the discussion about Chinese car companies and EVs are going to only get more geopolitical in nature over time due to real world developments and geopolitical priorities, and it's better to openly acknowledge them than to dismiss them.
I think it isn't productive if members get angry and pissed over political hostilities and resulting in non-productive exchanges over multiple pages, but it is also not a good idea to pretend that Chinese car company expansion and investments in western nations is just business as usual.
Like, from where I'm sitting I fully agree that for BYD and other Chinese companies of course they want to invest in, cooperate with and pursue expansion in western markets... but I also am aware that it is possible within half a year that western governments may just declare by fiat that all of their cars are banned from being sold and their investments to be seized, simply based on political winds, even if they know that China would retaliate against western car companies operating in China.
As for BYD's factory in California, I wouldn't really say that's BYD being very good at navigating geopolitics so much as no one has really noticed them there yet.