Miscellaneous News

supercat

supercat

Colonel
Taar said:
Live in China right now, this is pure BS.
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Let me guess: the Chinese media aren't portraying the US nearly as negatively as the US MSM do to China. Let's wait and see what happens when the next round of US provocations start over the Taiwan issue/tech sanction/trade.

This is the sort of headline that could only be dreamt up by the most bloodthirsty warmongers imaginable.
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I doubt the US can handle China alone. But the coffer of the Military-Industry-Complex must be filled at all cost.
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1722628475604095411

Ukraine. Israel. Can America Support Two Wars and Still Handle China?​

To U.S. allies in Asia, the sudden focus on Gaza risks progress on America’s long-delayed pivot to the Indo-Pacific region.
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The imbecile really thinks that Taiwan can win an arms-race against China?
The best way to avoid an invasion is for Taiwan to arm up like Israel so Beijing knows it would fail.
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https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1722293281302704561

Seriously?
The United States will oppose efforts by China to become involved in any potential reconstruction of Ukraine.
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https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1722425787209367655
 
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FairAndUnbiased

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
GZDRefugee said:
I hate to break it to you but median disposable income is still significantly higher in the US, even after accounting for PPP. Unfortunately, as long as the USD holds reserve status and is propped up by fiat, their export of currency will likely keep their economy in the black for decades to come. Demand for worthless pieces of paper is still quite resilient. As for safety and satisfaction, that only matters if Americans can emigrate, something that the government is cracking down hard on.

I agree that China does not need to match US income on a per capita basis. However, take a look at this:
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View attachment 121200
From Table 1, we can see that the top 16.3% (only 228 million people at most) of Chinese families earn more than USD $4800/yr. Meanwhile for Americans, the median family income was USD $68,000/year. The difference is greater than an order of magnitude. CNY PPP multiplier is 4.208 btw.

Largely irrelevant. EV sales only accounted for 6% of new car sales in 2022. The market share is growing but ultimately miniscule as of current figures. Unless you can prove that China's PPP multiplier is >15, the fact on the ground is that middle class Americans are wealthier than upper class Chinese.
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人均月收入 is per person income not household income.

For household income you have to multiply by household size because this is per person not per household.
 
Staedler

Staedler

Junior Member
Registered Member
GZDRefugee said:
If that's the case then the best approximation for the median would be the average of the middle 40%, which would be ¥63,021. ¥35,029 would be the bottom of the partition. Why is this table done like this? Makes things extremely confusing.

If you want to compare family disposable income, it was ~$15,000 for the US in 2019.
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I think disposable is a better comparison because of tax level differences. In any case, China reported a median 31,370/year in 2022. This is from the median of 45,123 and 17,734 for urban and rural residents respectively.

PPP multiplier is 4.022 in 2022, so that is approximately equivalent to 11,219 USd/yr per urban household.

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The US generally does not report on median disposable income per household. It's always either median gross or average disposable. So we have to do some heuristic calculations. Based on the median gross household income in the USA plus the gross-disposable household income by percentile in Canada, in the best case it's 31,900 per household in the USA. Given the Gini is much higher in the US compared to Canada, the actual median should be much lower than this $31,900. Without concrete basis, maybe around $25,000.

Of course this is disposable income, not discretionary. Given the social goods provided in China which are not in the US, the difference should further shrink.
 
T

Taar

Junior Member
Registered Member
SilentObserver said:
The table's title is "家庭人均月收入" which translates to "per capita monthly household income" and the 3rd column "人口数(万人)" translates to "Population (10,000 people)" and totals 1.4 billion so it's counting the entire population of China, including those not participating in the labor force. In
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or 55% of the population. For an approximation of incomes of the labor force participants we need to increase the income ranges in this chart by 82%.

The bottom 4 rows totals the 16.3% of the population in your example, adjusted to reflect incomes of working population and on an annual basis, the annual salary ranges would be:
- 65,000-109,000yuan ($8,900-15,000USD)
- 109,000-218,000yuan ($15,000-30,000USD)
- 218,000-436,000yuan ($30,00-60,000USD)
- 436,000yuan+ ($60,000+)
This is just an approximation to adjust from total population per capita to working population.
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All of China's released numbers are disposable income(I did a search a few years back, all the numbers China released on income are disposable income), while the US number is per capita income, so you can not just compare like this. Also people have a lot of "invisible" incomes.

"2019年，中国每月税后可支配收入超过2万元的人数，应该至少超过1千万，这远远超过北师大抽样统计推算的70万人，差距来自于对高收入群体的抽样比例过低。"
 
bajingan

bajingan

Senior Member
ACuriousPLAFan said:
Looks like China's frontyard is going to get busier...

Seriously though, China really, really, really needs to build up her PLAAF, PLAN and PLARF more aggressively than ever before. Not to shut down trade routes, but to become a potent stratgic depth shield for the mainland across the IndoPac.
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Can China persuade or even bribe Pakistan to be more active in kashmir region as counterbalance to India? I believe China has that sort of influence over Pakistan
 
GZDRefugee

GZDRefugee

Senior Member
Registered Member
SilentObserver said:
The table's title is "家庭人均月收入" which translates to "per capita monthly household income" and the 3rd column "人口数(万人)" translates to "Population (10,000 people)" and totals 1.4 billion so it's counting the entire population of China, including those not participating in the labor force. In
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or 55% of the population. For an approximation of incomes of the labor force participants we need to increase the income ranges in this chart by 82%.

The bottom 4 rows totals the 16.3% of the population in your example, adjusted to reflect incomes of working population and on an annual basis, the annual salary ranges would be:
- 65,000-109,000yuan ($8,900-15,000USD)
- 109,000-218,000yuan ($15,000-30,000USD)
- 218,000-436,000yuan ($30,00-60,000USD)
- 436,000yuan+ ($60,000+)
This is just an approximation to adjust from total population per capita to working population.
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I chose to use the whole population for effect. If you look at my previous responses, I did so to deliberately steel-man @ZeEa5KPul's argument that there are 330 million Chinese who match US income. I very specifically took 16.3% of China's population to maximize confidence interval. This is especially generous considering the 330 million would be 23.6% of China's population. That's practically half a standard deviation from a quick empirical rule calculation. Every single t-test, F-test I did concluded the same thing: outside of 99%, 95%, 90% confidence interval. There is simply no way that there are 330 million Chinese who match US income.
 
GZDRefugee

GZDRefugee

Senior Member
Registered Member
FairAndUnbiased said:
人均月收入 is per person income not household income.

For household income you have to multiply by household size because this is per person not per household.
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Again, I chose to extrapolate as a proportion of 1.4 billion to maximize confidence interval and prove a point. If you want to get into the nitty-gritty, look at ZeEa5KPul's post that I was responding to. Ask yourself this: what is China's east coast population, what is their average income, do they as China's most prosperous region, earn as much as the average American?
 
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