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H

H2O

Junior Member
Registered Member
Eventine said:
The reason Japan and South Korea will work with the US is because China is "eating their lunch," so to speak.

Advanced East Asian economies compete over the same industries - high tech., advanced manufacturing, ship building, IT, media exports, etc. China is beating Japan - and increasingly South Korea - in all of these domains. They're losing market share and orders. Their economic life lines are more and more dependent on supplying components and tools to Chinese companies, and with the shift to self-sufficiency under Xi Jinping due to national security concerns, even that line is being cut.

This is why they will fall in line behind the US - because it's in their interest to do so. China is beating them, and they have no way to address that but to knock China down, because they have neither the market size nor the capital to compete with China directly. They need the US to sabotage China, because otherwise they're toast.

Now, is there an alternative to what they're doing? Sure. They could reach an agreement with China over establishing a collaborative supply chain, where China agrees to depend on them for certain products and components, and vice versa, so they'll always have industries that they "own" and which China largely stays out of. But to do that, they'd have to abandon their alliances with the West, first, otherwise they can never be reliable components in a Chinese supply chain.

That, however, they will never do. You won't ever convince the Korean or Japanese public that they should rather be friends with China, than the West. This is because their societies are deeply infiltrated by Western media and intelligence. They have already convinced themselves of "China bad."

So they will march to the drum of inevitable war and be the front line soldiers of future Western aggression.
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It takes considerable effort and time to reverse 60+ years of indoctrination. Unfortunately, war does seem more plausible. Already they got Russia to fight. China is next followed by the grand prize, Iran.
 
P

pmc

Major
Registered Member
BoraTas said:
Russian liberals are so disconnected from reality. They might not like Putin, but they should realize they are in the same boat. As a Turk, this is also something I must pay attention.
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Russia does not have much liberals. it is just they are more visible.
Also there is not much practical difference between liberals and conservatives in Turkey. these things are reflected how Turkey organized society that is beneficial to liberals. think tourism and airline. or just pick vehicle brands. majority of sells are from EU/US in Turkey.
this Crimea snow video. what kind of vehicles you see. and than that Vesti TV vehicle.
 
B

Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
Eventine said:
The reason Japan and South Korea will work with the US is because China is "eating their lunch," so to speak.

Advanced East Asian economies compete over the same industries - high tech., advanced manufacturing, ship building, IT, media exports, etc. China is beating Japan - and increasingly South Korea - in all of these domains. They're losing market share and orders. Their economic life lines are more and more dependent on supplying components and tools to Chinese companies, and with the shift to self-sufficiency under Xi Jinping due to national security concerns, even that line is being cut.

This is why they will fall in line behind the US - because it's in their interest to do so. China is beating them, and they have no way to address that but to knock China down, because they have neither the market size nor the capital to compete with China directly. They need the US to sabotage China, because otherwise they're toast.

Now, is there an alternative to what they're doing? Sure. They could reach an agreement with China over establishing a collaborative supply chain, where China agrees to depend on them for certain products and components, and vice versa, so they'll always have industries that they "own" and which China largely stays out of. But to do that, they'd have to abandon their alliances with the West, first, otherwise they can never be reliable components in a Chinese supply chain.

That, however, they will never do. You won't ever convince the Korean or Japanese public that they should rather be friends with China, than the West. This is because their societies are deeply infiltrated by Western media and intelligence. They have already convinced themselves of "China bad."

So they will march to the drum of inevitable war and be the front line soldiers of future Western aggression.
Click to expand...
This is only a problem if your thinking is limited, unlike the Chinese government's.

Weapons are being built up that can not just defend the country but also counterattack and occupy the enemies. Alliances are forged with countries that will supply all of China's resource need, and be front line soldiers in great numbers should a war begin as well.

So what if American aggression exists? If not for German aggression, America and the USSR would never have become global powers. And in the same way, putting down American aggression will make China's return to the world stage complete.

In the midst of chaos there is also opportunity. When America attempts to invade China's east, it will cause the biggest smokescreen in the world. Therefore, when China uses the smokescreen as a cover to neutralize Japan and Korea, no one in the global community will question Chinese actions.
 
H

H2O

Junior Member
Registered Member
sunnymaxi said:
Maduro calls Xi and Putin "big brothers" and calls for LatAm nations to form alliance with China and Russia. As more and more capitals might seek to ally with Beijing, the question is, if China is ready for an alliance structure befitting a superpower.
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I don't remember the details but it's been said that China doesn't like formal alliances due to past experiences many centuries ago.
 
bajingan

bajingan

Senior Member
Eventine said:
The reason Japan and South Korea will work with the US is because China is "eating their lunch," so to speak.

Advanced East Asian economies compete over the same industries - high tech., advanced manufacturing, ship building, IT, media exports, etc. China is beating Japan - and increasingly South Korea - in all of these domains. They're losing market share and orders. Their economic life lines are more and more dependent on supplying components and tools to Chinese companies, and with the shift to self-sufficiency under Xi Jinping due to national security concerns, even that line is being cut.

This is why they will fall in line behind the US - because it's in their interest to do so. China is beating them, and they have no way to address that but to knock China down, because they have neither the market size nor the capital to compete with China directly. They need the US to sabotage China, because otherwise they're toast.

Now, is there an alternative to what they're doing? Sure. They could reach an agreement with China over establishing a collaborative supply chain, where China agrees to depend on them for certain products and components, and vice versa, so they'll always have industries that they "own" and which China largely stays out of. But to do that, they'd have to abandon their alliances with the West, first, otherwise they can never be reliable components in a Chinese supply chain.

That, however, they will never do. You won't ever convince the Korean or Japanese public that they should rather be friends with China, than the West. This is because their societies are deeply infiltrated by Western media and intelligence. They have already convinced themselves of "China bad."

So they will march to the drum of inevitable war and be the front line soldiers of future Western aggression.
Click to expand...
japan maybe they will go all the way with the americans, but south korea i don't think so, simply because north korea is there to check any south korea belligerence against China
 
B

Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
H2O said:
I don't remember the details but it's been said that China doesn't like formal alliances due to past experiences many centuries ago.
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As far as I see it, it's just purely out of practical concern.

China is the defending power, because it fundamentally just needs to stall in order to win, while US needs to make moves.

This has the advantage in that even if China don't give hard guarantees, people will naturally come to them because US is the one that is expanding and stepping on everyone's toes. States like Venezuela and Russia have nowhere to go, because US is pressing on them.

Not having their partners set in stone lets China cast a very wide net over their potential allies. For example, if China strongly supports Iran, then Saudi Arabia would likely never support China for the future, thus burning this bridge.

As the defending power, it is smart to not form the alliance until the final moment, because then, partners are more likely to ignore their differences in the face of a very palpable threat, and you can get a multi-ideological alliance instead of a single ideology one.
 
ZeEa5KPul

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
AssassinsMace said:

Peter Zaihan is an idiot that pulls crap out of his ass to make his points. He claims Mao implemented China's one-child policy. Mao is the reason why the population exploded. China's one-child policy wasn't enacted until after he was dead.
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As much as I loathe idiots like him, I have to admit that he's useful. A useful idiot, but still useful. America can believe one of two things:
1. China is unstoppable and it's going to be the wealthiest, most technologically advanced, and most military powerful state on Earth and America's only chance is to launch a war now before it's too late.
2. Everyone in China will die of old age in 10 years or whatever garbage that idiot is spewing.

Even though the stupidity of 2 hurts my brain and irks me to no end, I'd much rather Americans believe 2 than 1.
 
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