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Petrolicious88

Senior Member
Registered Member
Phead128 said:
This.

Post-Putin will likely be an Westophile and secure US/EU sanction relief in a quasi-alliance to contain China. A reverse Nixon if you will. So China should either secure a formal treaty (marriage) or just maximize the benefits of a Putin handjob before his successor flirts with suitors and you get AIDS/HIV.

Regardless, China will be the most powerful nation on earth by the time Putin dies, so it will be foolhardy for a successor to ally with West against China, since China will have far deeper economic relations with Russia than West...but don't underestimate Westophilia among Russian elites.
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Russian elites are not the problem. People that are graduates of elite Russian political programs are not the problem; they are highly suspicious of the West.

Ordinary Russian citizens are the ones that are more “westophilia”.
 
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B.I.B.

Captain
antiterror13 said:
NZ has been doing it for long time with Pharmac and it has been so successful, it seems US is the only few countries not doing it
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Don't get me going about Pharmac. It is also limited by how much money they get from the Govt. Because of this, they have to concentrate on value for money thus resulting in newer generation pharmaceuticals being a rarity. The government has raised the price of cigarettes because of the health problems it causes. Every year tax on tobacco raises enough money for lung cancer patients to be treated with the best drugs available. Will they do it ..... no. Apparently, there is a medicine that is very good at prolonging the life expectancy of lung cancer patients but it is denied to them and because it has proven very good at treating melanoma patients Pharmac has made it available to them... Rant over
 
A

antiterror13

Brigadier
Temstar said:
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It's not unique that China's government can bargain with the big pharmas to get cheap drugs, lots of countries with universal health can do this.

So really if you think about it, what's really happening here is the people of US are subsidising the other countries by paying more for drugs over in the states due to their crappy health care system.
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NZ has been doing it for long time with Pharmac and it has been so successful, it seems US is the only few countries not doing it
B.I.B. said:
Don't get me going about Pharmac. It is also limited by how much money they get from the Govt. Because of this, they have to concentrate on value for money thus resulting in newer generation pharmaceuticals being a rarity. The government has raised the price of cigarettes because of the health problems it causes. Every year tax on tobacco raises enough money for lung cancer patients to be treated with the best drugs available. Will they do it ..... no. Apparently, there is a medicine that is very good at prolonging the life expectancy of lung cancer patients but it is denied to them and because it has proven very good at treating melanoma patients Pharmac has made it available to them... Rant over
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Agree that Pharmac is not perfect, but way better than most countries in the world, let alone the US
 
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antiterror13

Brigadier
Overbom said:
I am not as pessimistic about Russia as some people are.

The Elites are more Western oriented is a given. After all, they grew up, lived, when the West was extremely powerful while China was still nothing in the world stage

That China has now grown doesn't make too much difference because this is a psychological thing. Can these people who lived their entire lives with a powerful West, very weak China, now easily accept that China is powerful? The answer is, no. And even if it was yes, they would still subconsciously think that the West is still superior

With growing trade between China-Russia, more technological dependence of Russia from Chinese suppliers, more Russians learnign Chinese language (and vice-versa), and more cultural exchanges, it is natural that the two countries will keep getting closer. And after some time, even when Putin is gone, there would be sufficient benefits and linkages that the Elites wouldn't want to change course

IMO if Putin persists until 2030, then after that even if he is gone, the relations between Russia-China would still grow or at the very least become stable
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I don't think Russia will have an option to "abandon" China. Russia is enjoying huge Chinese market and the market will be several times bigger than EU. Most Russia don't trust the US, in fact I have some Russian friends here that hate American, .... yes "HATE" ;)
 
Phead128

Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
antiterror13 said:
I don't think Russia will have an option to "abandon" China. Russia is enjoying huge Chinese market and the market will be several times bigger than EU. Most Russia don't trust the US, in fact I have some Russian friends here that hate American, .... yes "HATE" ;)
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Just to play Devil's Advocate.

What if I said back in 1950s:

"I don't think China will have an option to "abandon" the Soviet Union. China is hugely dependent on Soviet technology, assistance, and the West HATES China and full-scale embargos on China. Most Chinese don't trust the Americans, and in fact, I have some Chinese friends here that hate Americans,..... yes "HATE""

and then Nixon happened, US-China quasi-alliance against Soviet Union, and Soviet Union collapse. What's preventing a Reverse Nixon? Hatred alone and economic ties wasn't enough to stop China from becoming quasi-allies with West/US against Soviet Union. Anything can happen. Esp. since Russian billionaire oligarchs are Westophiles (see their mansions in London) and potential discord over Central Asia/Artic sphere of influence.
 
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Phead128

Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Crang said:
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How come they make it seem like Xi is omnipotent and losing control at the same time
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Astute observation @Crang!

As the famous Emberto Eco once noted, one of the top hallmarks of FASCISM is that they make their "enemies" (e.g. Jews) appear both Stong and Weak at the same time.

Features of Fascism Propaganda:

14. The enemy is both strong and weak. “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
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You always notice the continuous shifting rhetorical focus is China at same time "too strong" (economic/tech/world hegemony) and "too weak" (draconian, unstable, regime collapse) at the same time. It's the same strategy they used against the Jews who were "too strong" (finance/money dominance) and "too weak" (genetics/greed/inferior) at the same time and guess who got genocided by the Nazi Fascists?
 
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