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Miragedriver

Brigadier
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

The article was in the newspaper “La Nacion” buried in the economic section. I guess that it puts to bed our discussion of the possible replacements for the Mirages for the FAA. Just reading this article makes me sick to my stomach.


“En trascendidos desde el Ministerio de Defensa a cargo de la Dra. Nilda Garre se habría llegado a un acuerdo para reemplazar los veteranos Mirages, pronto a cumplir 37 años, aunque los que están operativos tienen 30 años de servicios y conque cuenta el Estado Argentino y que dotan a la Fuerza Aérea en la VI Brigada Aérea en Tandil por unos 12 Mirage 2000 de los ´90, en un monto que rondarían los 90 millones de euros con entrega a partir de 2015; dada las premuras por el vencimiento de los actuales sistemas argentinos, surge la alternativa de dos etapas, primero los Mirage F1 jordanos de los ´80, modernizados por Francia, o estirar hasta esa fecha la baja programada en el 2011 del actual sistema de armas y luego la llegada de los 2000s franceses. Quedaría la duda que tan actualizada estaría y el equipamiento con el cual llegarían si es que se lograse el acuerdo, teniendo en cuenta por las desventajas con que estaría en comparación con sus vecinos de la región, que aunque no se manejan hipótesis de conflicto con ningunos de ellos y año tras año se avanzan en la creación de unas FFAA regionales, se mantienen todavía la disputa sobre la soberanía de las Islas Malvinas con el Reino Unido y este para dicha fecha ya tendría en el archipiélago una dotación de Eurofighter o los de 5* generación como los F-35.Será tal vez los que deje Brasil ante el reemplazo que estos estarían por hacer ante el posible candidato que seria el RAFALE”

In negotiations conducted by Doctor Nilda Garre of the Ministry of Defense an agreement as been reached to replace the Mirages the veteran Mirages of the Air Force, that will soon complete 37 years of service, although those that are operational have 30 service years These aircraft have been assigned to the 6th air brigade near Tandil. Negotiation for 12 Mirage 2000 of 1990 vintage have an agreed to tender, in an amount 90 million Euros with deliveries commencing in 2015 with the decommissioning of the current Mirage fleet in 2011. The replacement will be in two stages, the first will be the purchase of Mirage F1s from Jordan of 1980 vintage. These aircraft are to be modernized by France, which will be phased in 2011 prior to the arrival of the Mirage 2000 weapon system. The purchase of the new weapon systems still place the nation defense at a disadvantage in comparison with its neighbors of the region, who do not foresee any conflict within the near future. With the exception of a dispute over the sovereignty of the Falklands Islands with the United Kingdom. The Euro fighter defends the archipelago, which is a 5th generation aircraft like the F-35. Perhaps those (Mirages) that Brazil decommissions after the replacement with the RAFALE could also be a candidate (for purchase)


I would have preferred some upgrade Mig-23MLD over the Mirage F-1, but as you can see they paid 100 million US for the 12 Mirage F-1s, plus the upgrade in France and 90 million Eros for the 12 Mirage 2000. I wonder how many hours are on those Mirage 2000?
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

I guess that this is the official nail in the coffin for the FAA. I when from one of the best in latin america to now being a joke.
 

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Perhaps things could change when the leadership changes no?
 

Red___Sword

Junior Member
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Perhaps things could change when the leadership changes no?


Hahaha... siege, we have plenty of reason to believe you are an active agent of CIA (Chinese Inter-forum Association), trying to overthrown a legit civil-govt, by posting threads...!

PS. I like this part:

The Euro fighter defends the archipelago, which is a 5th generation aircraft like the F-35

So that put J-20 kind of stuff, into 6th gen si-fi aircraft... how fast the world evolves!
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Hahaha... siege, we have plenty of reason to believe you are an active agent of CIA (Chinese Inter-forum Association), trying to overthrown a legit civil-govt, by posting threads...!!

I guess that I would be considered a co-conspirator along with siegecrossbow

PS. I like this part:


So that put J-20 kind of stuff, into 6th gen si-fi aircraft... how fast the world evolves!

I think that we can all agree that journalists (in general) are not the sharpest tools in the shed!
 

Ian_PD

New Member
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

...
I would have preferred some upgrade Mig-23MLD over the Mirage F-1, but as you can see they paid 100 million US for the 12 Mirage F-1s, plus the upgrade in France and 90 million Eros for the 12 Mirage 2000. I wonder how many hours are on those Mirage 2000?

MiG-23s? Why? I know than was quite comparable with the Mirage F1 some time ago, but today? Not even for free... Find some Mirage F1 airframes in good condition is complicated, the Ecuadorian F1 are an exception but needs a complete overhaul and upgrade to become useful.

What's the problem with the Mirage 2000 ex-AdA? Even the 2000C variant is a substantial leap from the Mirage III/5 actually in service in the FAA, and don't be worried about the remaining hours of the airframe, the Mirage 2000 have an airframe life of 7,500 hours and is guaranteed to 5,000 hour, just applyng an SLEP to the airframe and you have an aircraft for the next 15 years, at least. Is an excellent transitional fighter between the current obsolete inventory and a future fighter I think.

But I consider than the FAA needs something more heavy than a Mirage 2000 class fighter, and my favourite option is the Su-30, currently in KnAAPo are stored 18 Su-30, ex-IAF, returned to the manufactured because it was more cheap build a new Su-30MKI than upgrade the original Su-30s. With an upgraded A-4AR as a complement (the downgraded APG-66 can be replaced by a Grifo 2000 at LRU-level and also the engine can be replaced by a modern and more powerful F404) the FAA can recover its past strenght. The Su-30 are available and with a good upgrade can be a match for the RAF Typhoons deployed in Malvinas.

Greetings from Perú.
 
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druid84

New Member
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Can't agree more about the SU-30 variants, they would definitely give the Eurofighters a run for their money, plus theres the SU-35/37 (get a little confused what the exact difference is) they would be more than a match for the British plans. Also the Mirage 2000 is ok too, especially for the price, plus if they got that im sure France would help out with the Nuclear submarine program, just like what they are doing for the Brazilians.
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

MiG-23s? Why? I know than was quite comparable with the Mirage F1 some time ago, but today? Not even for free... Find some Mirage F1 airframes in good condition is complicated, the Ecuadorian F1 are an exception but needs a complete overhaul and upgrade to become useful.

At least the Mirage F-1s utilize the same (upgraded version) engine as the Mirage III and V. This will help a tremendous amount in the incorporation of the aircraft to the FAA. The Mirage 2000 will be a good match again the F-16s provided they have the most modern missiles from France.

The Mirage F-1 that where purchased from Jordan are original and have not been modernized since there purchase. Supposedly they have 1,500 to 2,000 hours on them. They are to be modernized in France. With what, I do not know. Perhaps similar to the Spanish or Moroccan ones.

The reason I mentioned the Mig-23 is because in all official combat reports the Mig-23 has always beat the Mirage F-1. The Mig’s could be purchase for next to nothing and upgraded with some more modern avionics. At least it would be a modernized 3rd generation aircraft that could be obtain inexpensively. The Russian equivalent of “Top Gun” used Mig-23’s in “slash and dash” attacks on Mig-29s and Su-27s with a high degree of success. These aircraft would not fare will in a dogfight, but utilized with AWAC support could inflict damage to oncoming fighters (or attack aircraft). They could then leave the dogfight to the Su-27, JF-17, J-10, Mirage 2000 ext…

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¡No hay libertad sin justicia y no hay justicia sin políticos honestos!​
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Can't agree more about the SU-30 variants, they would definitely give the Eurofighters a run for their money, plus theres the SU-35/37 (get a little confused what the exact difference is) they would be more than a match for the British plans. Also the Mirage 2000 is ok too, especially for the price, plus if they got that im sure France would help out with the Nuclear submarine program, just like what they are doing for the Brazilians.

The Su-27/Su-30/J-11 would be an incredible aircraft for the FAA to operate. The only drawback is the cost, which would make these fine machines unobtainable.
 

druid84

New Member
Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Speaking of cost does anyone know the potential budget of Argentina and is there any possibility of them joining with Brazil to buy fighters? I know they are part of Brazils transport aircraft program and I think might be getting help from them with submarines.
 
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