Ladakh Flash Point

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Biscuits

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Sardaukar20 said:
China and India killing each other and wrecking their futures is the American wet dream. No more threats of Asian rising powers. The way China is acting with regards to India is exactly trying not to fall into this US trap. India continues to provoke and escalate, while China always tries to talk India out of it to no avail. India says that the Galwan incident is Chinese provocation. But who really started this whole mess? Its India with their abrogation of Article 370 and subsequent aggressive rhetoric and moves against Aksai Chin. India is too stupid to see this old American trick of divide and conquer, so it is a lost cause trying to reason with them. China has no choice, but to manage this new reality.
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Attacking India wouldn't necessarily weaken China. US going to war with Iraq didn't end the threat from the Americas, although it arguably deflected them from other things for a few years.

Demostrating the PLA in 2020 against a suitably weak yet overconfident and overhyped target can send signals to the rest of the world that China is a reliable military ally, it would further increase the status of its arms products and show other challengers that a conflict with them is not worthwhile.
 
Xizor

Xizor

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I support China investing into South East Asia (ASEAN) countries. A prosperous ASEAN is less of a threat to China than a prosperous India. (Because with size comes power, ASEAN countries are resource poor and will hit a plateau of growth).

It China invests into ASEAN (by shifting low quality mass manufacturing there, then India will not become an attractive option for European, East Asian and American companies). Ultimately, it is profits that capitalism wants and making ASEAN region more profitable than India takes the shine out of India (making it less attractive for FDI).

Whatever FDI India has been getting is mostly to supply its own domestic market. ASEAN manufacturing should compete and win against India in securing International Globalist Companies Manufacturing deals.

Will ASEAN become more bold against China as it prospers? Yes. But what if they do hate China? Enmity between ASEAN countries itself will grow as they compete with each other for resources and deals. I think Philippines will go for US, Vietnam and Indonesia will balance between US and China, while Thailand, Laos, Combodia and even Myanmar could more or less be in good terms with China.
There are also chances that Hatred for China can subside ( because it's mostly Chinese companies that invested first).

Edit : Chinese companies could also expand its market to this prospering ASEAN countries. Having ASEAN countries with a better purchasing power /wallet size will help in more sales for Chinese companies.
 
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Inst

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India had an option to try to hedge the US and China, but it seems that they've begun sensing the economic shifts caused by the COVID-19 crisis, and that the US might not be usable as a hedge vs China.

I've talked with Indian contacts about how the "Century of Humiliation" and Japanese invasion shook China out of its civilizational complacency and made it understand how force and development were necessary to avoid being bullied by other countries. There are in fact Indian articles arguing that the "Chinese threat" is a strong justification for modernization, because let's face it, India is only a "modern" country because of its "democracy", when the cultural and societal configuration is premodern, due to the very strong traditional value system in India.
 
manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

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India’s online shopping festivals show its anti-China sentiment is more talk than action

At 10am on Aug. 6, Redmi was the most prominently displayed brand across Amazon India and Flipkart, the two leading e-commerce platforms in India. Meanwhile, brands owned by Dongguan-based BBK Electronics Corporation—realme, Oppo, Vivo, OnePlus, and iQOO—were also in the limelight.

Despite all the uproar, Chinese smartphone sales have held on steadfast. OnePlus 8 Pro, which was launched in India on June 18, was
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. An Indian smartphone ecosystem without Chinese brands is almost unforeseeable at this point in time, experts said.
 
Sardaukar20

Sardaukar20

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manqiangrexue said:
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India’s online shopping festivals show its anti-China sentiment is more talk than action

At 10am on Aug. 6, Redmi was the most prominently displayed brand across Amazon India and Flipkart, the two leading e-commerce platforms in India. Meanwhile, brands owned by Dongguan-based BBK Electronics Corporation—realme, Oppo, Vivo, OnePlus, and iQOO—were also in the limelight.

Despite all the uproar, Chinese smartphone sales have held on steadfast. OnePlus 8 Pro, which was launched in India on June 18, was
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. An Indian smartphone ecosystem without Chinese brands is almost unforeseeable at this point in time, experts said.
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Quote from the article: "While the nationalist sentiment is high, Indian brands are few and far between. Lava,
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of India’s smartphone ecosystem, became
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in the face of stiff competition. Meanwhile, Noida-based I Kall aroused controversy in February last year when one of its phones
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, costing an 8-year-old four fingers."

This effectively sums up the success story of 'Make In India'.
 
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Maxef208

New Member
Registered Member
Sardaukar20 said:
China and India killing each other and wrecking their futures is the American wet dream. No more threats of Asian rising powers. The way China is acting with regards to India is exactly trying not to fall into this US trap. India continues to provoke and escalate, while China always tries to talk India out of it to no avail. India says that the Galwan incident is Chinese provocation. But who really started this whole mess? Its India with their abrogation of Article 370 and subsequent aggressive rhetoric and moves against Aksai Chin. India is too stupid to see this old American trick of divide and conquer, so it is a lost cause trying to reason with them. China has no choice, but to manage this new reality.
Click to expand...

I think India thinks it can outwit the US and somehow secure the US as an ally and developer to allow it to rise to how China has and usurp power. The thing is India has never hidden it's superpower aspirations, and shouting "largest democracy in the world" and claiming some imaginary ties to both Brits and Americans doesn't mean the US won't see you as a threat and knock you down just the same. I think a lot of nationalist Indians don't realize how little respect America has for India, and just love Indian workers as result of brain drain, that they can dispose of once they served their purpose. Like a lot of colonized nations and people's there's a weird mentality where overwhelming power with mercy is seen as kindness and kindness and deescalation is seen as weakness and green light to attack along with mentality to provoke and take what you can get away with, and when the other party gets angry, play victim.
 
Sardaukar20

Sardaukar20

Captain
Registered Member
Maxef208 said:
I think India thinks it can outwit the US and somehow secure the US as an ally and developer to allow it to rise to how China has and usurp power. The thing is India has never hidden it's superpower aspirations, and shouting "largest democracy in the world" and claiming some imaginary ties to both Brits and Americans doesn't mean the US won't see you as a threat and knock you down just the same. I think a lot of nationalist Indians don't realize how little respect America has for India, and just love Indian workers as result of brain drain, that they can dispose of once they served their purpose. Like a lot of colonized nations and people's there's a weird mentality where overwhelming power with mercy is seen as kindness and kindness and deescalation is seen as weakness and green light to attack along with mentality to provoke and take what you can get away with, and when the other party gets angry, play victim.
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That's why the Indians are so stupid now. When Japan was challenging the US economy in the 1960s to 1980s, Japan was USA's enemy no.2 behind the Soviet Union. There was much anti-Japanese propaganda in the US in the 1980s to 1990s. Japan was a democracy and a key US ally. That didn't stop the US from spewing hate on Japan and forcing them via the Plaza Accord to surrender their economic development. China knows this all too well. Being a democracy doesn't spare your country from America's wrath.

India never existed as a state prior to the British Raj. There is ancient history in India, but it comes from the myriad of South Asian kingdoms that were all conquered under the British. India lacks the glory of an ancient unified empire unlike China or Russia. This inferiority complex binds well with delusions of building a new 'Indian Empire', giving us this potent mix of fascist BJP India. Aggressive, but also stupid and cowardly.
 
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Brainsuker

Junior Member
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Biscuits said:
Attacking India wouldn't necessarily weaken China. US going to war with Iraq didn't end the threat from the Americas, although it arguably deflected them from other things for a few years.

Demostrating the PLA in 2020 against a suitably weak yet overconfident and overhyped target can send signals to the rest of the world that China is a reliable military ally, it would further increase the status of its arms products and show other challengers that a conflict with them is not worthwhile.
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Yes, but not India. Even if their military is weaker than China, but they have more than 1 billions people. It will lock China in an undesired-able situation. Plus, US can intervene any time to help India. Like what they did in WW1 and WW2. So unless India escalate the tension first, China should refrain from any wolves behavior.
 
plawolf

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Chintychin said:
I think this Channel belongs to a Non resident Indian. Based on the videos they post and their take on biden and sanders making america a joke and how George floyd protests is run by Islamists now. So it is US propaganda.
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US extreme right wing propaganda. It’s interesting that there seems to be so much common ground between US neo-Nazis, HK/TW/FLG White worshippers and Jai Hind crowds.

I think it should be a badge of honour that nazis around the world unite to hate China. Far better than being cheer on by Nazis around the world anyway.
 
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SpicySichuan

Senior Member
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Inst said:
What I'm told is that there's an airlaunched version of CJ-10; supposedly the CJ-20.

In terms of holding off Indian capabilities, there's no technological limitation on the Chinese side; i.e, the most you could claim is that the Chinese need a nice current-generation 100mm top-attack ATGM for the ZTQ-15s (point of 100mm is so that it'd also fit into Type-59s and other obsolescent reserve tanks). The J-10 could also be upgraded further to give it a clear superiority over the Rafale in matching the emergency 11G capability, but the J-20 can handle the Rafale as much as any other 5th gen could handle a 4.5++ gen aircraft.

The bigger limitation for the PLA is deployed capabilities on the Tibetan plateau; for instance, the same DF-16s pointed at Taiwan, were they massed on the Indian border, could put every single Indian airbase under threat and threaten Indian cities without resorting to nuclear weapons. To the best of our knowledge, there aren't DF-26s loaded up on TAR to snipe Indian ships the moment they're in deep water and unsalvageable. And of course, PLAAF airbase infrastructure in Tibet is serviceable (lots of civilian airports), but generally shoddy (needs dedicated stealth hangars for J-20s and munitions and fuel stockpiles).

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The Indians, properly speaking, are an annoyance, not a threat. Unless China is distracted with a Taiwan scenario (and one possibility for Ladakh is to prevent the Indians from interfering in a Taiwan scenario with a flank attack), there's nothing the Indians can really do to China. The Himalayas make land invasion to either side of the border onerous and the fact that the Chinese command the strategic high ground means that they can lob ballistic missiles at India from relatively protected positions.

I think the Chinese goal with India is to get them into a state where India can't provide a threat to a Chinese attempt on Taiwan, because they're diplomatically contained (neutral or allied), or because their military capability has been neutralized.
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Sounds like a nasty two front war to me. Since China's attention has been mainly devoted to Taiwan, Beijing really needs to defeat a potential Indian "invasion" of Tibet with far inferior troop numbers, but superior weapon and C2 quality.
 
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