Jian's vs F-22/F-35??

peperez · Dec 23, 2007

kickars said:
Strange??? Where do you get the idea of 'early J-10 model is just the same as Lavi' from? Any hard evidents(photos)? Don't tell me you just heard it from somewhere on internet. Coz as far as we all know here that the very first J-10 prototype looked exactly the same as the latest J-10A (different paint job though). Please, do some research before making such a statement.

Oh, who says we have to discuss aircrafts which are already in service? As far as I know there isn't such a rule on this forum. So we can discuss any aircrafts' VS we like here.

J-10 has the same J-9 wing planform...

Cheers

Pepe

sidewinder · Dec 23, 2007

AssassinsMace said:
Under ideal test conditions anything can look like it works. And again do we have to repeat all the systems that have failed from the first Gulf War to the Israeli/ Lebanon conflict from last year? A lot of holes there that can be exploited.

And who says China will stick to it's 12-24 ICBMs. Is there some sort of law that prevents China from building more in response? Or is the default belief is China is incapable of making more ICBMs for some reason?

Again if there's nothing to worry about then why all the alarm over China's military?

sure china may increase its long range icbm's but america's doctrine is to first hit the enemy hard and and at its capabilities to strike back that includes nuclear missile facilities. the few that may survive can be safely negotiated with ABM and THAAD and the like. let us not forget that america is not only investing in ABM's on american soil they installing a global missile interception network capable of handling misiles long before they reach the continental united states.

the threat of iran to install this ABM network is an excuse for this purpose though mainly aimed at russias vast missile network.

china is not yet highly credible threat to the united states but it is on track to rival the united states as the succsesor to the erstwhile soviet union in terms of military power in the near future.

currently i think united states just a liitle over hypes its power to maybe secure more funding just my two cents.

Jeremy Sun · Dec 23, 2007

AssassinsMace said:
I'm sure if Israel had a part it was consulting. But anyone can claim everything is American or Russian/Soviet then by that logic.

I never said that the F-22 isn't the best fighter in the world. But as you said patriotism pulls the wool over people's eyes. The F-22 is no different. If the F-22 was so secure why not export it to even the closest of allies. If the Chinese are as inept and backwards as people say, then selling it to Japan would be no problem. Then there's this paranoia that contradicts the stereotypes that a Chinese spy only has to simply look at it to reverse engineer. But no one has to worry about that because the Chinese don't have the technolgical capability to copy advanced F-22 technology. Then why not sell the F-22 to Japan? ... Confusing.

Just having it fly around near potential adversaries exposes information that can be used against it. That's why the F-22 stays clear from areas of the world where someone can learn a thing or two. Just like what the Serbs did with F-117s flying over them constantly. The F-22 may still be the best fighter in the world but it too doesn't live up to the hype or the Pentagon wouldn't be so worried about selling it. They know what potential adversaries can learn from it flying around. Meaning it can be exploited by conventional means.

You don't think China is even working on a counter to the F-22? What happened to your estimate of 30 years until first flight? Wouldn't China have particpated with Russia in a 5th generation fighter if they don't have anything at work to counter the F-22? What's China doing then? If China is spinning on its inept and backward heels, then why all the alarm over China's military? There should be no worry at all.

Why not sell F-22 to Japan? You have to understand that, unlike previous aircraft like F-4 and F-15, F-22 is "stealth" and it's very difficult to detect by radar. What if Japan reverse-engineered it and mass-produced it to start WW3, or use it to bomb White House and Capitol Hill?

Jeremy Sun · Dec 23, 2007

zyun8288 said:
I agree about your point that patriotim blinds peoples' eye, for example, your canadian patriotism has stopped you from finding out that J10 only took 18 years to get inducted into PLAAF. Also you are even blinded to the information about JXX on HuiTong's web site, where you got your J10=Lavi conclusion 10 years ago.

Budy, this is information age, don't stop absorbing new info:coffee:

1. First of all, I'm Jeremy Sun, one of the 88th generation descendants of Sun Zi (Sun Tzu). I don't consider myself Canadian even though I have a Canadian passport now.

2. J-10 program officially started in 1983 (I read it somewhere so just trust me on this). Rafale flew in 1986 and F-22 flew in 1990. Yet they all entered service a couple of years ago. J-10 took just 18 years is absolutely not true, it took about 30 years.

3. It's been proven by psychology that patriotism affect the majority of people, especially in homogeneous countries like China and Japan and France and Germany etc., not so much in USA because it is a melting pot.

tphuang · Dec 23, 2007

Jeremy Sun said:
1. First of all, I'm Jeremy Sun, one of the 88th generation descendants of Sun Zi (Sun Tzu). I don't consider myself Canadian even though I have a Canadian passport now.

2. J-10 program officially started in 1983 (I read it somewhere so just trust me on this). Rafale flew in 1986 and F-22 flew in 1990. Yet they all entered service a couple of years ago. J-10 took just 18 years is absolutely not true, it took about 30 years.

3. It's been proven by psychology that patriotism affect the majority of people, especially in homogeneous countries like China and Japan and France and Germany etc., not so much in USA because it is a melting pot.

look, we don't care who you are really. It would be nice if you read some other people's posts and learn a little bit before shooting your mouth off. You read a bunch of stuff, but everything tells us that J-10 started in 1986. That's when CAC beat out SAC for the 4th generation fighter competition. I'm sure most of the people on this forum have read more than you. You can continue mouthing off, but that will just make you sound more and more silly.

Why not sell F-22 to Japan? You have to understand that, unlike previous aircraft like F-4 and F-15, F-22 is "stealth" and it's very difficult to detect by radar. What if Japan reverse-engineered it and mass-produced it to start WW3, or use it to bomb White House and Capitol Hill

there are two major cases of technology leak with the Japanese involving sensitive technologies, that's why.

AssassinsMace · Dec 23, 2007

currently i think united states just a liitle over hypes its power to maybe secure more funding just my two cents.

Interesting how China is the worst country in the world according to many in the West. The West has bombed countries for less. Why not China? If China is a future threat, then the West should take out China now when according to you they can. What ever happen to right to first strike on countries that are threats? The more you wait, the more it costs the West. The real reason why is because it's not as easy as you think or you would've bombed China in all the simplistic reasoning that says it's easy to win. Do it!

Jeremy Sun · Dec 23, 2007

AssassinsMace said:
Interesting how China is the worst country in the world according to many in the West. The West has bombed countries for less. Why not China? If China is a future threat, then the West should take out China now when according to you they can. What ever happen to right to first strike on countries that are threats? The more you wait, the more it costs the West. The real reason why is because it's not as easy as you think or you would've bombed China in all the simplistic reasoning that says it's easy to win. Do it!

Germany was way more dangerous than China is now back in WWI and WWII and it was taken out. The last thing China should do is follow Germany's path and wage WWIII. Remember, now is a crucial time in human history, as scientists from all over the world (primarily in the West) are trying to find parallel universes and discover ways of time travel and colonization of other planets before the next ice age hits earth or some other huge disaster happens (like another huge asteroid strike). Right now, war is not priority, what is important is for human race to find a way to survive in this vast and dangerous universe (which we realized quite recently).

AssassinsMace · Dec 23, 2007

Jeremy Sun said:
Germany was way more dangerous than China is now back in WWI and WWII and it was taken out. The last thing China should do is follow Germany's path and wage WWIII. Remember, now is a crucial time in human history, as scientists from all over the world (primarily in the West) in trying to find parallel universes and discover ways of time travel and colonization of other planets before the next ice age hits earth or some other huge disaster happens (like another huge asteroid strike). Right now, war is not priority, what is important is for human race to find a way to survive in this vast and dangerous universe (which we realized quite recently).

Where did I say that China was waging war? The only one talking waging war and beating the other side is you guys. So you should stop and think before you post because the only one following Nazi Germany's path is the one waging wars around the world and I don't see China at war with anyone at the moment.

If war is not a priority then why is the US fighting two wars then? You should really think about what you post because you're really sounding questionable now especially with the science fiction.

Jeremy Sun · Dec 23, 2007

AssassinsMace said:
Where did I say that China was waging war? The only one talking waging war and beating the other side is you guys. So you should stop and think before you post because the only one following Nazi Germany's path is the one waging wars around the world and I don't see China at war with anyone at the moment.

If war is not a priority then why is the US fighting two wars then? You should really think about what you post because you're really sounding questionable now especially with the science fiction.

1. Science fiction? Trust me, you don't want to wake up tomorrow morning to find the earth enveloped in another ice age. It isn't science fiction, it's real. From past records, it can be reasonably concluded that ice ages occur every 30000 years or so, and guess what, the last ice age ended around 30000 years ago which means the next one can be here any day now. And yes, they come suddenly, which hasn't been explained yet.

2. I don't know why you put me as "the other side". I was born in PRC and I still consider myself Chinese, just that I'm not so blindly patriotic. America is doing everything it can to maintain world peace at the moment. When Iran claimed to want to develop nukes, what did China say? Nothing, because China wants America to be tied up in fighting with Iran so it can zoom ahead and reclaim Taiwan. China is not doing much to maintain world peace, given it's one of the five permanent security council members. Also, who bombed the World Trade Center and killed more than 3000 civilians? That's right, religious fanatics. Who's going to fight them? That's right, none other than America.

AssassinsMace · Dec 23, 2007

And the US is going to save the world from this ice age? I think that's called nature at work. So why does the world have to appreciate US scientists if nature is going to do its work? You think US scientists have the power to stop it? Now you think the US can win against Axis of Evil partner, Mother Nature?

So just because you say you're Chinese, what does that mean? You constantly state it like it means something. Are you saying just because you have the pessimistic view of China that agrees along with the Western neo-con point of view it's universally recognized as true?

Jian's vs F-22/F-35??

peperez

New Member

sidewinder

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Jeremy Sun

Banned Idiot

Jeremy Sun

Banned Idiot

tphuang

Lieutenant General

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General

Jeremy Sun

Banned Idiot

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General

Jeremy Sun

Banned Idiot

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General