JH-7/JH-7A/JH-7B Thread

[PrOeLiTeZ]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

bubble canopy? raised seats?? simply put, the JH-7/A does not need such useless up-grades that only serve to drive up the unit price. I highly doubt having 360 degree view would serve its purpose as an anti-shipping platform where the targets are hundreds of kilometers away. If you get in a dog fight in a JH-7/A then im guessing ur only real option would be to afterburn your way out of there as IMO the JH-7/A is not a dog fighting platform.

Also i don't agree more composites should be used. Most composites are used on multi-role / air-superiority fighters where the light materials will increase manouverability and range. On a strike aircraft like JH-7/A, composite material will again, only serve to drive up unit costs. It doesnt need to be manouverable and range can easily be increased by external tanks, although asmittedly it would require some sacrifice in its payload.
composite are impractical on strike aircraft where it needs a high sortie/maintainence ratio. Anyone here seen a crunched peice of composite? I have, on a ferrai f40 when it crashed on a test track. The whole frontal section had to be replaced whereas a bent peice of aluminium can simply be hammered back into place.

Im no expert in the field of aircraft manufacture so the above is only my opinion

Using afterburners to get away from dogfights?? You must be joking the JH-7 isnt the most quickest nor fastest aerial platform the PLAAF have. Only having max speed of Mach 1.7 most aerial fighter platforms have Mach 2+ so having a 360 view is still vital for strike platforms.

Other strike fighters dump and go with their superior speed of getting in and out. But cannot say th same for JH-7. So personally raised seats and bubble cannopy would be an ideal upgrade. If cost was such a big issue than why bother in any upgrade that will raise cost to any aerial platform. Upgrades will no matter what increase the cost but it all comes down to is the upgrade worth the money being thrown into it.

Adding composites reduces the weight giving better T2W ratio, it will allow more payload of weapons or additional fuel tanks. If China is achieving to become an effective superior 21st century aerial arsenal then its aircraft cost will increase no matter what. Cost is an issue but if it was so huge then why bother with J-10/11 just mass mass produce J-8 with BVRAAM then.

 

[crobato]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

Do you know what raised seats and bubble canopies do? They raise drag. And you don't need drag if your TWR isn't that great to begin with. A bubble canopy will only let you see who is going to kill you better.

 

[adeptitus]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

(Is there an "ideal JH-7/A upgrade" thread?)

Given limited resources, I'd spend the funds on upgrading the JH-7/A's sensors, anti-shipping weapons (air launched AShM), and engine technology. These technical advances can be applied to other aircraft.

Ship based air defense system has gotten more advanced with longer range. For a strike aircraft to succeed, its weapons will need to have good range, and the ability the penetrate air-defense systems. The NSM is one example of evolving AShM technology.

 

[PrOeLiTeZ]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

Do you know what raised seats and bubble canopies do? They raise drag. And you don't need drag if your TWR isn't that great to begin with. A bubble canopy will only let you see who is going to kill you better.

Raise seats doesn't always result in increase in drag, but Bubble Canopy does indeed increase a little in drag but still gives better view of angle to see where hostile fighters are, even if they cannot out run or out manuver them it'll give the pilots still a fighting chance to at least return fire. Lets move on...

SRAAM was in the article last month about an further improved PL-9 variant, would like to see how much its seeker technology the PLAAF has strided to...would like to see the JH-7/A loaded with more ammo for its cannon

 

[Pointblank]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

Raise seats doesn't always result in increase in drag, but Bubble Canopy does indeed increase a little in drag but still gives better view of angle to see where hostile fighters are, even if they cannot out run or out manuver them it'll give the pilots still a fighting chance to at least return fire. Lets move on...

SRAAM was in the article last month about an further improved PL-9 variant, would like to see how much its seeker technology the PLAAF has strided to...would like to see the JH-7/A loaded with more ammo for its cannon

It also improves vision out of the cockpit for ground attack missions, as sometimes, you will need to visually identify a target, as your various sensors might not give you a clue as to whenever or not that target is a potential friendly. The improvement of situational awareness is crucial in war, as a lot of friendly fire incidents occur when there is mistaken identity.

 

[RavenWing278]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

It also improves vision out of the cockpit for ground attack missions, as sometimes, you will need to visually identify a target, as your various sensors might not give you a clue as to whenever or not that target is a potential friendly. The improvement of situational awareness is crucial in war, as a lot of friendly fire incidents occur when there is mistaken identity.

mmmmmmmmm good luck spotting a target in the the sky or a ship in the ocean hundreds of kilometers away with your eyes

 

[Pointblank]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

mmmmmmmmm good luck spotting a target in the the sky or a ship in the ocean hundreds of kilometers away with your eyes

More like you been told you have to attack a target at a certain location, and there is a need to visually identify the target before attacking to ensure the target is enemy.

 

[RavenWing278]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

More like you been told you have to attack a target at a certain location, and there is a need to visually identify the target before attacking to ensure the target is enemy.

I'm assuming the target your talking about is a ship or a ground installation. It would be naive to think that you would come within visual range of the said target and not be targeted by ground or ship based SAM's. If the target is a troop convoy etc then looking at the amount of friendly fire in the war in Iraq by US war planes, i would conclude that bubble canopies do jack all. Altitude will make WVR confirmation speculative at best.

 

[Pointblank]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

I'm assuming the target your talking about is a ship or a ground installation. It would be naive to think that you would come within visual range of the said target and not be targeted by ground or ship based SAM's. If the target is a troop convoy etc then looking at the amount of friendly fire in the war in Iraq by US war planes, i would conclude that bubble canopies do jack all. Altitude will make WVR confirmation speculative at best.

You won't believe how many times in war that the need to visually identify a target prevented attacks on friendly or neutral forces, even today. Especially when coordinating with ground forces for close air support, you will need to see where that laser guided bomb will drop, otherwise you might have dropped that bomb on a friendly.

Do not think that a radar, a FLIR is the end all and be all of sensors; they can be fooled or suffer from technical glitches. At times, the good old Mark 1 eyeball is required. At times ambiguity over the target becomes an issue; your told there is a contact at a particular location, but whenever or not that target is a enemy, friendly or a neutral is unknown. Therefore, flying up close to investigate is important.

 

[RavenWing278]

Re: JH-7/JH-7A Thread

You won't believe how many times in war that the need to visually identify a target prevented attacks on friendly or neutral forces, even today. Especially when coordinating with ground forces for close air support, you will need to see where that laser guided bomb will drop, otherwise you might have dropped that bomb on a friendly.

Do not think that a radar, a FLIR is the end all and be all of sensors; they can be fooled or suffer from technical glitches. At times, the good old Mark 1 eyeball is required. At times ambiguity over the target becomes an issue; your told there is a contact at a particular location, but whenever or not that target is a enemy, friendly or a neutral is unknown. Therefore, flying up close to investigate is important.

and what if the target you just so happen to be flying over is an enemy position who, for the sake of argument, are armed with with SAM's?