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Jura said:

well now I watched Dubai promo ad first to later hear (since 00:45) [Trump meant] "... we wanted to be responsible and go through all diplomatic means, to get their attention first; if that doesn't work, General Mattis will take care of it ...":
Haley: If we have to, N. Korea will be 'destroyed'

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this is supposed to be intimidating enough, I guess

Click to expand...

I saw this...and there is definitely a pretty straight up warning there.

...and as far as I am concerned it is about time.

Really and truly, this is something that China should take care of IMHO. They alone have the influence to call Kim in check. He may not like it...but China can bring him to heal of they get serious about it.

The rest of the world wants them to...and IMHO, the PRC is missing a HUGE opportunity to build a massive amount of goodwill everywhere if they would do this.

Jeff Head said:

I saw this...and there is definitely a pretty straight up warning there.

...and as far as I am concerned it is about time.

Really and truly, this is something that China should take care of IMHO. They alone have the influence to call Kim in check. He may not like it...but China can bring him to heal of they get serious about it.

The rest of the world wants them to...and IMHO, the PRC is missing a HUGE opportunity to build a massive amount of goodwill everywhere if they would do this.

Click to expand...

Jeff would you please open
China's strategy in Korean peninsula (Temp closed) https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/chinas-strategy-in-korean-peninsula-temp-closed.t6680/

Jura said:

Jeff would you please open
China's strategy in Korean peninsula (Temp closed) https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/chinas-strategy-in-korean-peninsula-temp-closed.t6680/

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Done.

I do not know how it works in other country's but if Russia lobbed a missile over Scotland it would be pretty damn serious

If India launched a missile over Pakistan I can tell you forces would go to FOB

If Syria launched a missile over Israel all hell would break lose

If Iran launched one over Saudi Arabia you can be sure war would be imminent

This is a serious provocation in any part of the world, things can go wrong that missile could fail and land in Japan

I am shocked at how placid Japan has been at these North Korean missiles

If bully's throw stones and no one does anything he will throw bigger stones tomorrow

So make up your mind, engage now or face bigger problem tomorrow

Jeff Head said:

I saw this...and there is definitely a pretty straight up warning there.

...and as far as I am concerned it is about time.

Really and truly, this is something that China should take care of IMHO. They alone have the influence to call Kim in check. He may not like it...but China can bring him to heal of they get serious about it.

The rest of the world wants them to...and IMHO, the PRC is missing a HUGE opportunity to build a massive amount of goodwill everywhere if they would do this.

Click to expand...

Yes, China could really pressure Kim if they wanted to.

But goodwill doesn't isn't going to make up for the very real risks and costs.

And suppose the USA did leave SK tomorrow, as has been suggested on occasion by Trump.

NK would be less paranoid about being regime-changed by the USA, and less insistent on obtaining nukes. Then NK has little reason to keep threatening to nuke the USA. Plus China would no longer have an interest in keeping NK as a buffer zone against the presence of US troops on the Korean peninsula.

But SK would feel more vulnerable, until they developed their own BMD or came to an agreement with China (in deploying Sino-THAAD?)

If the US left the area...within a year or two you would have a nuclear armed S. Korea and a nuclear armed Japan.

Plain and simple.

Both nations are capable of it...but with the US in a storng allince with them, they do not feel the need and thus proliferation is held in check.

China needs to do the same for N. Korea IMHO. Because the apple cart is being upset by N. Korea's proliferation, and then foolishly brandishing them about threatening people.

He cannot help himself because he is unstable, immature, and a little tyrant.

Anyhow...for these reasons the US is not intent on leaving the region...and certainly not going to do so under threat.

asif iqbal said:

I do not know how it works in other country's but if Russia lobbed a missile over Scotland it would be pretty damn serious

If India launched a missile over Pakistan I can tell you forces would go to FOB

If Syria launched a missile over Israel all hell would break lose

If Iran launched one over Saudi Arabia you can be sure war would be imminent

This is a serious provocation in any part of the world, things can go wrong that missile could fail and land in Japan

I am shocked at how placid Japan has been at these North Korean missiles

If bully's throw stones and no one does anything he will throw bigger stones tomorrow

So make up your mind, engage now or face bigger problem tomorrow

Click to expand...

Amen.

Jeff Head said:

If the US left the area...within a year or two you would have a nuclear armed S. Korea and a nuclear armed Japan.

Plain and simple.

Both nations are capable of it...but with the US in a storng allince with them, they do not feel the need and thus proliferation is held in check.

China needs to do the same for N. Korea IMHO. Because the apple cart is being upset by N. Korea's proliferation, and then foolishly brandishing them about threatening people.

He cannot help himself because he is unstable, immature, and a little tyrant.

Anyhow...for these reasons the US is not intent on leaving the region...and certainly not going to do so under threat.

Click to expand...

I said the US leaving SK, not the US leaving Japan. If the Trump administration believes that China should solve NK, this is what I think would happen.

As you say, it would take some time for either SK and Japan to build and test nukes. Personally I think a minimum of 2years in the case of SK.

And what would happen within that timeframe?

SK and China get much much closer because they are both unhappy with Kim's behaviour.

At the same time, Kim is much less worried about a regime change. Remember the US is the only country that can get away with almost no casualties. If China and/or SK try anything, Kim knows that he has leverage. Yet he also knows that NK is screwed if it has both a hostile China and hostile SK to deal with.

So it sets the stage for some sort of peaceful cooperation or reunification in the future.

Jeff Head said:

If the US left the area...within a year or two you would have a nuclear armed S. Korea and a nuclear armed Japan.

Plain and simple.

Both nations are capable of it...but with the US in a storng allince with them, they do not feel the need and thus proliferation is held in check.

China needs to do the same for N. Korea IMHO. Because the apple cart is being upset by N. Korea's proliferation, and then foolishly brandishing them about threatening people.

He cannot help himself because he is unstable, immature, and a little tyrant.

Anyhow...for these reasons the US is not intent on leaving the region...and certainly not going to do so under threat.

Click to expand...

I disagreed, if South Korea and Japan gets nukes, than so can Iran. And that would upset the current Middle East status quo. IMO the idea that the US is there to make sure South Korea and Japan don't have nukes to protect themselves from anybody is absurd. Is North Korea the current #1 regime changer of the world? They just want nukes to prevent the US from doing what they did all over the Middle East in the last 2 decades.

I guess the fat kim must have known the fate of Khadafi and Sadam Hussein after they give up the Nuke option
They get hung

Beside It is not China that has dispute with North Korea It is the US So the onus is on US to do the work threatening and blustering is not going to move the Noko. They rather eat grass then not having the bomb and they are not crazy. I am not saying Noko is right but they have legitimate security concern that need to be addressed and it is the US and South Korea that need to address those concern