J-35A fighter (PLAAF) + FC-31 thread

[Alfa_Particle]

By the way, do you remember by post a few weeks ago, where I told you I have satellite images showing three J-31 (now J-35A) at SAC??

Indeed.

Turns out those news are particularly true, at least. I called the J-35A designation.

Now let's see if the other news are true. If so, that would confirm my crackpot guess.

My point is that nozzles should be considered divorced from the actual engine identity to begin with, unless otherwise indicated.
In past years, the identity of Al-31 and WS-10 and even one set of new engine nozzles on J-20 whose identity we still do not fully know, were all varyingly misidentified either as WS-10 or WS-15 before being brought back down to earth.




I think it is a valid comparison, because WS-19 is of a similar technological pedigree to WS-15, and considering it will power both the PLAN's 5th generation naval fighter and the PLAAF's new second type of 5th gen fighter, it is still a notable development.
Furthermore, as a new high performance fighter engine and one that is the "intended powerplant" for J-35/A, it automatically is treated with the same kind of seriousness as WS-15 is.

It does no harm to us to have opinions fall on the more cautious side of the fence, yet it presents heightened expectations and risk of predictive overreach and "overoptimism" if opinions fall onto the other side of the fence.

Ultimately I agree that it is possible the engine you're talking about (or indeed, any of the engines shown) might plausibly be WS-19.

But I am highly opposed to the idea of using words suggesting it is "likely" because it presents the perils of overreach and circulating an idea that becomes entertained which then has to be dialed back.
If someone like Yankee tomorrow straight up says "one of the J-35As at Zhuhai was powered by WS-19" then great, let's call it. Without that, then we should approach the idea with meekness.

Man, I wrote a response TWICE and the internet went out. I genuinely don't have the energy to rewrite that fully again right now. Tomorrow maybe.

Know that there's a difference between "Mars-slamming-into-where-we-are-right-now-because-the-Three-Body-folks-thought-it-would-be-funny" possible and "it's gonna rain tomorrow" possible. I'm suggesting the latter.

 

[Dylan Nguyen]

[...]

01's nozzles are a bit special - we've never seen this type of nozzles on any versions of J-35/A before. 12 petals, with the outer layer's petals having tiny, finer serrations each side making a crown-pattern (marked in yellow) and the inner layer having the same amount of teeth/serrations without the extra finer ones (marked in blue). There's also the odd vent doors looking mechanisms (marked in red).
View attachment 139232
View attachment 139233
[...]
So, it might sound crazy, but, hear me out. 02 and 03 are respectively WS-13E and WS-21. Don't they look like serrated versions of a traditional RD-93?
View attachment 139236

I disagree. The nozzle on 01 which you keep referring to is more like RD-93 than the nozzles on 02 and 03.

Both RD-93 and this mystery nozzle have these protrusions (red arrows pointing to them) on the outside of the petals. Additionally, both RD-93 and this mystery nozzle both have 24 petals each.

I am fairly certain that the engines on 01 are a derivative of RD-93.

 

[Schwerter_]

View attachment 139255
I disagree. The nozzle on 01 which you keep referring to is more like RD-93 than the nozzles on 02 and 03.

Both RD-93 and this mystery nozzle have these protrusions (red arrows pointing to them) on the outside of the petals. Additionally, both RD-93 and this mystery nozzle both have 24 petals each.

I am fairly certain that the engines on 01 are a derivative of RD-93.

Honestly I think at this point both nozzle types spotted on the J-35A have pretty significant visual similarities to the original RD-33 nozzle, which makes me wonder if they’re both in fact based on that.

Wild guess so don’t take anything said below too seriously: all engines we see so far are actually ws21, which itself is in essence an extensively modified ws13. The different nozzle designs indicate “variations” within the ws21 family, for example the silver-ish nozzle found on J35A #01 and naval J35 is one variant while the black nozzle found on J35A #02 and #03 is another variant. (Yes I do think that J35A #01 has essentially the same engine type with a slightly redesigned serration profile as the naval one from late 2021 and 2022)

Also I’m still waiting on pics with good lighting and enough resolution to confirm this but I have a suspicion that the black nozzles are essentially the same design as the silver ones, again just with different serration designs and a coating. The visually smaller and more numerous serrations are probably just a result of the inner layer of outer petals (hopefully that makes sense, I’m referring to the outer circle of petals where half of them are exposed to the outside and the other half is mainly obstructed and showing only a small portion through the gaps of the outer layer) having serrations as well, making it out as if there are twice as many serrations and half the size.

Here’s an visual explanation, excuse my shit hand drawing

 

[ZeEa5KPul]

Wasn't it rumored that WS-21 uses different hot section designs based on the WS-19? That could explain it.

Also, "visually similar shock diamonds" is an extremely bad way of judging an engine, especially with the amount of variables.

Meh, it's not a hill I'm going to die on. All these dissertations are neat, but all I care about is "engine stronk."

 

[by78]

More afterburners with shock diamonds + other nice images.

 

[Dylan Nguyen]

Honestly I think at this point both nozzle types spotted on the J-35A have pretty significant visual similarities to the original RD-33 nozzle, which makes me wonder if they’re both in fact based on that.

Wild guess so don’t take anything said below too seriously: all engines we see so far are actually ws21, which itself is in essence an extensively modified ws13. The different nozzle designs indicate “variations” within the ws21 family, for example the silver-ish nozzle found on J35A #01 and naval J35 is one variant while the black nozzle found on J35A #02 and #03 is another variant. (Yes I do think that J35A #01 has essentially the same engine type with a slightly redesigned serration profile as the naval one from late 2021 and 2022)

Also I’m still waiting on pics with good lighting and enough resolution to confirm this but I have a suspicion that the black nozzles are essentially the same design as the silver ones, again just with different serration designs and a coating. The visually smaller and more numerous serrations are probably just a result of the inner layer of outer petals (hopefully that makes sense, I’m referring to the outer circle of petals where half of them are exposed to the outside and the other half is mainly obstructed and showing only a small portion through the gaps of the outer layer) having serrations as well, making it out as if there are twice as many serrations and half the size.

Here’s an visual explanation, excuse my shit hand drawingView attachment 139257

Agreed. The nozzles on naval J-35 are likely the same or very similar to that of the nozzles on 01, but it’s hard to tell without better photos.

I also agree that 02 and 03 likely share the same nozzles.

 

[_killuminati_]

What are these bumps on the stabilizer and on the intake near the wing? Never noticed them before. The one under the wing isn't present in all types.

View attachment 139005

View attachment 139000

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looking at how easy US can send their comando inside pak soil to take out binladen , how much effective us intelligence help ukraine himmars , drone attack russian target deep inside rusland/black sea fleet , oil facility ...etc, and how easy israel assassin high ranking iran/hamas V.I.P

You don't actually believe that nonsense, do you?
[Don't respond here; offtopic]

 

[Nx4eu]

What are these bumps on the stabilizer and on the intake near the wing? Never noticed them before. The one under the wing isn't present in all types.


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You don't actually believe that nonsense, do you?
[Don't respond here; offtopic]

What the actuators?

 

[_killuminati_]

What the actuators?

I had suspected after posting it is an actuator on the stabilizer, but not under the wing on the intake.

From Deino's images, bump isn't visible on all

 

[Nx4eu]

I had suspected after posting it is an actuator on the stabilizer, but not under the wing on the intake.

From Deino's images, bump isn't visible on all
View attachment 139314View attachment 139315

I think it's just how the tail booms blends with the rest of the fuselage, only appearing like a bump due to certain angles and lighting conditions. The curve is so shallow that without a light being cast directly above it's nearly invisible.