J-35A fighter (PLAAF) + FC-31 thread

[ougoah]

If the J-35AE is a thing, and semi-credible leakers suggest it has been built, then an export customer possibly has already signed up for non-insignificant numbers of these fighters.

I am not against exporting. Just tempering this excitement. Export versions have a meaningful enough separation in many ways including performance and capability otherwise they wouldn't exist. Not only does the US nearly always do this, so did the Soviets and so do the Russians. The French used to when they offered leading edge equipment. China wouldn't be any different.

This does not have anything to do with incorporation, use, and how custom made a platform is. All that is only semi-related to the above.

You can have a well integrated weapons system imported and put to great use. One that was custom developed to suit your needs. It can perform perfectly well and then some... but it could also still be FAR inferior to the domestic version. I'm not saying that's the case, simply pointing out the validity of that logic.

As for the J-35AE being an export version somehow meaning China is comfortable exporting this level of equipment. Please slow down. It doesn't mean the AE has the same materials, full radar capability, access to all the same software and ECM/ESM. It might. It might not.

Even if it's a downgraded version, it is going to be better than a Su-57. On this I'm confident. At some point, dancing around impressively in the sky is just not the direction air combat has gone in. China agreed with the US air combat doctrine prevailing over the cold war era understanding of air combat. It's abundantly clear that China has taken it two steps further now with what it's revealed as the direction of 6th gen.

 

[TK3600]

Well to be honest we don't know if Pakistan is receiving J-35. Even if it were, perhaps China should consider these concerns. It has little experience in handling this unlike the west.



This is not true. You seem to be counting prototypes.

Prototypes can enter mass production at any time. It is not that the plane is not advanced, it is refining to be even better before mass production.

 

[ougoah]

Prototypes can enter mass production at any time. It is not that the plane is not advanced, it is refining to be even better before mass production.

Honestly, if 6th gen is as you claim, then there isn't really a point to start and scale up production of the J-35A ground based version. Naval version can still have a vital role to play until 6th gen carrier fighters but the fact that they are even doing a J-35A indicates that the J-50 is at least 5 years from PLAAF service.

 

[TK3600]

Honestly, if 6th gen is as you claim, then there isn't really a point to start and scale up production of the J-35A ground based version. Naval version can still have a vital role to play until 6th gen carrier fighters but the fact that they are even doing a J-35A indicates that the J-50 is at least 5 years from PLAAF service.

You know J-10 is still in production long after J-20 entered service right? Hell US is still making F-16 today, long after F-35 and F-22 entered service.

 

[Black Wolf]

If the J-35AE is a thing, and semi-credible leakers suggest it has been built, then an export customer possibly has already signed up for non-insignificant numbers of these fighters.

I am not against exporting. Just tempering this excitement. Export versions have a meaningful enough separation in many ways including performance and capability otherwise they wouldn't exist. Not only does the US nearly always do this, so did the Soviets and so do the Russians. The French used to when they offered leading edge equipment. China wouldn't be any different.

This does not have anything to do with incorporation, use, and how custom made a platform is. All that is only semi-related to the above.

You can have a well integrated weapons system imported and put to great use. One that was custom developed to suit your needs. It can perform perfectly well and then some... but it could also still be FAR inferior to the domestic version. I'm not saying that's the case, simply pointing out the validity of that logic.

As for the J-35AE being an export version somehow meaning China is comfortable exporting this level of equipment. Please slow down. It doesn't mean the AE has the same materials, full radar capability, access to all the same software and ECM/ESM. It might. It might not.

Even if it's a downgraded version, it is going to be better than a Su-57. On this I'm confident. At some point, dancing around impressively in the sky is just not the direction air combat has gone in. China agreed with the US air combat doctrine prevailing over the cold war era understanding of air combat. It's abundantly clear that China has taken it two steps further now with what it's revealed as the direction of 6th gen.

Good points, and healthy skepticism is needed. But the constant emphasis that export versions must be downgraded misses a key reality: China’s approach is very different from the US or EU. The West often ties arms sales with strict restrictions and supplies deliberately limited versions. That’s why many view exports through a US/EU lens and assume China must do the same.

In reality, China’s exports to Pakistan reflect a relationship based on trust and operational alignment, not just product dumping. While some tech separation is inevitable, it doesn’t mean the export J-35A is a crippled aircraft. It’s tailored to Pakistan’s needs and doctrine, and China has shown it can manage these transfers without compromising its own cutting-edge capabilities.

This difference in approach is why the export-versus-domestic narrative keeps resurfacing, it’s hard to adjust expectations shaped by decades of Western arms export norms.

 

[TK3600]

Good points, and healthy skepticism is needed. But the constant emphasis that export versions must be downgraded misses a key reality: China’s approach is very different from the US or EU. The West often ties arms sales with strict restrictions and supplies deliberately limited versions. That’s why many view exports through a US/EU lens and assume China must do the same.

In reality, China’s exports to Pakistan reflect a relationship based on trust and operational alignment, not just product dumping. While some tech separation is inevitable, it doesn’t mean the export J-35AE is a crippled aircraft. It’s tailored to Pakistan’s needs and doctrine, and China has shown it can manage these transfers without compromising its own cutting-edge capabilities.

This difference in approach is why the export-versus-domestic narrative keeps resurfacing, it’s hard to adjust expectations shaped by decades of Western arms export norms.

It is not a western thing, it is a cold war mentality. USSR was also known for downgrading exports more than US was. The funny thing is China today is closer to cold war US mentality than US today being willing to export advanced weapons, while US is similar to cold war USSR. But we are getting off topic so I will stop.

 

[ougoah]

You know J-10 is still in production long after J-20 entered service right? Hell US is still making F-16 today, long after F-35 and F-22 entered service.

This point is invalid because the F-16 production line in the US has been long established, in fact well established long before the F-22 was even in LRIP.

Contrast this with J-35 production only starting now. If 6th gen fighters can be fielded in a few years, it makes no sense to commit to any inferior fighters and their production lines. In the US example, the difference was around 3 decades for the F-16 to F-22 production start and 4 decades for the F-35. China is so different and faster at iterating engineered products that I can see a point to squeeze this down to even 7 to 10 years and it would still be okay, particularly if you can export them when 6th gen is being field.

The other explanation is that 6th gen is not being planned for carriers yet and so we're only considering the difference between carrier 6th gen and J-35 for PLANAF. In this case, sure 6th gen for PLAAF can go into service next week and it'll still make sense to build the J-35 because that's for carrier ops. The ground based version is just there as an additional export version and since it exists PLAAF may also be bothered developing training etc despite having 6th gen. But in reality, we should expect 6th gen to be ready similar to J-20 prototypes to service timeframe... possibly a little expedited due to China's ever improving tech and industrial capabilities.

 

[Deino]

Are we still on topic?

 

[tphuang]

As for the J-35AE being an export version somehow meaning China is comfortable exporting this level of equipment. Please slow down. It doesn't mean the AE has the same materials, full radar capability, access to all the same software and ECM/ESM. It might. It might not.

There are certain things that don't make sense to have export versions just due to production, quality and cost reasons. imo, Materials would be one of them. In fact, if you change the materials, that would change the weight of aircraft and possibly balance of aircraft. Also in terms of manufacturing, you'd have to figure out new ways to layer together composite materials with meta materials. These things all seem to be more trouble than they are worth. As radar tech continue to advance, more of the "stealth" probably reside in sig management and manipulation. So you can get significant separation in domestic vs export versions without getting into materials.

 

[Deino]

Cross Post from the J-20 thread …
Seems as if a grey J-20A (at least images 1 & 2) was seen again … as well as a J-35A.

(Images via @齐天的孙猴子 from Weibo)