J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread IV (Closed to posting)

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by78

General
@ by78 !

Thank You so much for all the images You post ... and Your nice notes to me ! :eek:

YB the way are these recent ones or still from the maiden flight +/- the days before or after ??? ... have there been and new additional flights so far ??

Thanks again,
Deino

You are welcome, Deino.

I'd love to share them just incase you want to use them in your publication.

I have no idea if these photos were taken recently, but they all have been posted on Weibo and other places within the past 10 days. I believe there is a good chance that they are from more recent flights.

Also, remember those yellow flowers in the earlier photos? They are missing from these photos, so they must be from days or even weeks after the maiden flight.
 
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by78

General
This is Prof. Zhang Weihong, responsible for some of the composite materials used on the J-20 and drone programs.

14075347893_06e850a603_o.jpg
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
What makes it look like so many different colors? Gray, green, silver... Personally I like the underside shot where it looked like gun metal blue.
 

Solaris

Banned Idiot
What I don't understand is why the designers of the J-20 didn't think to definitively hide the engine nozzles from a sideways view early on by using the vertical stabilizers and whatever that stubby wing thing is in the back, in the manner of the F-22 and even more so in the F-35. This seems to be such an obvious move that I keep being disappointed every time I look at a side view of the J-20.
 

by78

General
Another photo from the latest test flight. She's at her most svelte and photogenic on a bright and sunny day.

2048x1360
14071938325_0539c79393_o.jpg
 
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gambit

New Member
Hi everyone, I've been lurking these forums for years, thought may as well start posting :)
Interesting to note, the Boeing 6th generation concept has canards and dsi similar to J-20

New20FA-XX-1200_zps159ec603.jpg

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It is not the canards by themselves but the canards in relations to other structures.

I gave an explanation to my trainees many many yrs ago when I was in the aviation industry after the USAF. So pay attention...

sphere_wave_behav_1.jpg


In radar detection, the sphere is the ideal 3D body to establish baseline measurements and to calibrate radar systems.

There are three rules in radar cross section (RCS) control that made the sphere that ideal body:

- Quantity of radiators
- Array of radiators
- Modes of radiation

Rule 1: The sphere have only one radiator -- its surface.

Rule 2: The sphere have only one array of radiator -- curvature.

Rule 3: The sphere have two modes of radiation -- as shown. The modes are specular and if the diameter is less than 10 times the wavelength, the creeping wave behavior will occur. This is called 'the ten lambda' rule. Lambda is the Greek word representation of freq. If the diameter is greater (>10) than 10 times the wavelength, then the creeping wave behavior WILL NOT occur. The creeping wave behavior is the natural consequence of the diameter/freq relationship so even though it will not occur, it does not mean the surface wave behavior does not exist. Surface waves do exists.

Now we go to a more complex 3D body...

sharp_rounded_cubes.jpg


Both cubes have six sides. This is rule 1: Control of quantity of radiators.

Both cubes have their planar sides in the same configuration. This is rule 2: Control of array of radiators.

The left cube have sharp surface discontinuities that will create edge diffractions. The right cube have curvatures where the planar surfaces meet. This is rule 3: Control of modes of radiation. If we rotate both cubes under radar bombardment, most likely the red cube will exhibit different signatures and a lower RCS. Where both cubes will have the same returns is when both cubes present their planar sides to the seeking radar. But it will be the curvatures on the red cube that will create a different overall signature.

When the B-2's designers left out the vertical stabs, they obeyed all three rules. The absence of the vertical stabs is the reduction of radiators, and since the vertical stabs do not exist, they cannot be in relative positions with any other structures, so this fall under reduction of arrays of radiators. Remember, an aircraft is a complex body with many structures that are in relative positions and relationships to each other.

The corner reflector...

body_corner_reflector_ex.jpg


...Is a major no-no in RCS control and reduction.

If you are building a marine safety device, then a corner reflector is the appropriate structure, something like this...

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But if you want to build a radar low observable complex body, then a corner reflector must be avoided.

There are rules for the corner reflector as well:

- Avoid the corner reflector completely.
- If not possible, then avoid the 90 deg type.

The B-2 with no vertical stabs obeys rule 1 of the corner reflector rules set. The F-117, F-22, and F-35 with their canted vertical stabs could not obey rule 1 so they obeyed rule 2 of the corner reflector rules set.

All four aircrafts falls under the top rules for control of RCS factors/contributors:

- Quantity of radiators
- Array of radiators
- Modes of radiation

Do you understand now ?

So just because Boeing may have canards for the new 'stealth' fighter design, it does not mean somehow the criticisms about J-20's canards have been invalidated. When a canard moves, it falls under rule 2: array of radiators. A canard is a finite structure and impinging radar signals have to get off that structure somehow and some time. The modes of radiation would be specular and edge diffraction. Then because the canard is in close proximity with other structures nearby, such as the fuselage and the wing, rule 2 (array of radiators) is in play.
 

Solaris

Banned Idiot
So just because Boeing may have canards for the new 'stealth' fighter design, it does not mean somehow the criticisms about F/A-XX's canards have been invalidated. When a canard moves, it falls under rule 2: array of radiators. A canard is a finite structure and impinging radar signals have to get off that structure somehow and some time. The modes of radiation would be specular and edge diffraction. Then because the canard is in close proximity with other structures nearby, such as the fuselage and the wing, rule 2 (array of radiators) is in play.
Fixed it for you. And I agree. Canards are total bads. Boeing engineers clearly did NOT get the memo. They must be bads too.

Clearly we are going backwards in stealth design from 5th to 6th generation. Or not.
 
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