Combat radius: 1100KM
J-10 Thread IV
- Thread starter Jeff Head
- Start date
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
It is pointless talking about PL8 because the Chinese have move on. The standard issue short range missile for PLAAF is now PL10 and BVRM missile is either PL12 or PL15.
The same with Harpy it is outdated China can now produce sophisticated HALE UAV like soaring dragon CH5, Wing Loong II, Divine Eagle So many type I lost count
Some people like to stuck their head in the sand and pretend that time stay still but it is not. Wake up and smell the coffee.Like they say ignorance is bliss
China can now produce 5th generation fighter, giant freighter, HALE UAV, ICBM,Hypersonic glide, ASBM. VLRAA missile PLxx. And where is Israel? She still has to buy it from US and depended on US for the most modern fighter. Don't get me wrong Chinese and Jew respect each other because both of them are ancient people, share respect for education and family. But we come from different world. China provide sanctuary for Jewish refugee fleeing the prosecution and many of them return to Israel to become prominent in Armament industry .And as a gratitude some are helping China is some sector of armament I think it Tank gunnery with the blessing of US as China was so weak in 80's, and fearing invasion by the Soviets
The same with Harpy it is outdated China can now produce sophisticated HALE UAV like soaring dragon CH5, Wing Loong II, Divine Eagle So many type I lost count
Some people like to stuck their head in the sand and pretend that time stay still but it is not. Wake up and smell the coffee.Like they say ignorance is bliss
China can now produce 5th generation fighter, giant freighter, HALE UAV, ICBM,Hypersonic glide, ASBM. VLRAA missile PLxx. And where is Israel? She still has to buy it from US and depended on US for the most modern fighter. Don't get me wrong Chinese and Jew respect each other because both of them are ancient people, share respect for education and family. But we come from different world. China provide sanctuary for Jewish refugee fleeing the prosecution and many of them return to Israel to become prominent in Armament industry .And as a gratitude some are helping China is some sector of armament I think it Tank gunnery with the blessing of US as China was so weak in 80's, and fearing invasion by the Soviets
Last edited:
Hyperwarp
Captain
Emotional scenes. What was the occasion? Were those gentlemen retiring? I assumed that because their insignia was removed.
That was already known since some time, however I am surprised that the - IMO - first unit, the 21. Division was kept secret so long.
First, ancient history (In this case, Iran has a history of 2,500 years of civilization and the largest and widest empire in the world, and King of kings, Cyrus the Great, which is the world's first human rights text) Or politic not related to we Discuss.
- Again you making propaganda
- We talked about mid 80s and 90s and not now.
- Israeli military company like elbit or rafael one of most greatest military company, Now equipped 5th generation fighter F-35 for airforce by home made avionics.
- while china working in j-10A project still NO achievement to produce FWB for delta-canard-layout(in 80s/90s), and have good military relation with Israel, design team going to Israel and visited Lavi project, that very similar to the j-10A, And cooperate to transfer the technology(special avionics) from Israeli (obtain mony from dead project) to China.
We all know China got assistance from Israel for the J-10, but assistance is not the same as wholesale copying or being given the solutions.
superdog
Junior Member
Sorry, I'm a bit lost at what is being argued here.
Earlier you made a post like this:
Are you making claims or are you trying to ask questions because you don't know?
Are you suggesting that the J-10 has a short combat radius which the B/C versions should improve on, or are you simply curious about the J-10(A/B/C)'s combat radius?
Are you claiming that the J-10 is using US/Israeli components, or are you asking whether the J-10 uses these components?
If you're making claims, I am not seeing your supporting evidence. That China has visited Israel and studied the Lavi project is a well-known fact, but it was neither proof nor a strong indication that the J-10 uses US/Israeli components.
Did they learn something and got inspiration from the Lavi project? Most likely. Did it help them with J-10 development? Probably. But saying that they simply put US/Israeli components on the J-10, that's a different matter.
On the other hand, If you're just asking some straight forward questions, what's the deal with these arguments about propaganda and stuff?
Last edited:
Zool
Junior Member
I'm confused as well... How did it go from a question on Combat Radius to J-10 is Lavi?
If you are talking history of J-10, we can't know for sure how much involvement Israel may have had. China claims the design as an evolution of the J-9 and probably borrowed some ideas from Lavi. It certainly appears similar to both in areas.
But we know Israel did not sell FCRs or EW systems and China used its own Mechanical Array, conducted flight testing and weapons integration itself. So its almost certain the avionics were developed by China.
In fact didn't China start development of its own avionics and FBW on the J-7s/J-8s (I can't recall which)? China took the initiative to tweak, iterate and learn from those early Soviet aircraft it built years earlier, which obviously paid off for follow on programs. Now they've got the J-20 flying, a pretty complex design, with Chinese AESA Radar.
Israel definitely worked closely with China for a time. It was good business that could have gone MUCH further. The US axed that mid way through the Phalcon AWACS program though, when China was about to get its hands on some advanced microelectronics beyond what local industry could produce or Russia could supply. India has since become a consolation prize for that loss, but ask IAI and Elbit which market they would rather be in... Anyway that was what, almost 20 years ago now? China has obviously moved on in all fields and very quickly.
If you are talking history of J-10, we can't know for sure how much involvement Israel may have had. China claims the design as an evolution of the J-9 and probably borrowed some ideas from Lavi. It certainly appears similar to both in areas.
But we know Israel did not sell FCRs or EW systems and China used its own Mechanical Array, conducted flight testing and weapons integration itself. So its almost certain the avionics were developed by China.
In fact didn't China start development of its own avionics and FBW on the J-7s/J-8s (I can't recall which)? China took the initiative to tweak, iterate and learn from those early Soviet aircraft it built years earlier, which obviously paid off for follow on programs. Now they've got the J-20 flying, a pretty complex design, with Chinese AESA Radar.
Israel definitely worked closely with China for a time. It was good business that could have gone MUCH further. The US axed that mid way through the Phalcon AWACS program though, when China was about to get its hands on some advanced microelectronics beyond what local industry could produce or Russia could supply. India has since become a consolation prize for that loss, but ask IAI and Elbit which market they would rather be in... Anyway that was what, almost 20 years ago now? China has obviously moved on in all fields and very quickly.
When starting to design an aircraft you start collection information on comparable aircraft. For J-10 that included F-16 and Lavi. That gives you a starting point for weights and dimensions and suggestions for configurations. After that the real work begins.
The J-10 chief designer visited IAI Lavi, the short person in brown suit is J-10 Chief designer, J-10 has direct Lavi ancestry
See he is the same guy in front of the model and the same guy in brown suit in front of the Lavi
The original J-10 mock up, it was a Lavi