J-10 Thread III (Closed to posting)

[tphuang]

They can produce 2 regiments a year if they want. It's not a big deal, but a lot of it is limited by engine deliveries. They basically did not produce any new J-10s in 2008 and not much in the end of 2007 and beginning of 2009. So when they are ready to produce J-10, they normally produce around 50 a year. As for numbers, they have regiments in division 44, 1, 2, 3, 9 and 24 for sure. That's already 6 x 28 = 168. They also have 12 J-10s in the August 1st flight demonstration and 20 more J-10s at the FTTC. So, around 200 J-10s in total.

That's the ones we do know, there could be ones we don't know. As for engine numbers, they had 154 imported in the first two batches and then signed another 128 in the past year. So, they have around 282 AL-31FNs. And WS-10A is finally ready for mass production, so we will see how that will affect things.

 

[Lion]

Superpower in what area country economy? It still is focusing on country development, only coastal cities are moderately developed its flooding money into central china at the moment. Well China has only thought about itself and its done fine. China only cares about not military power. It caring about development and stability of the population. Your using prior WW2 thinking in 21st century? That is really outdated thinking. So then domino theory of communism is still at play? Asian invasion? Chinese people come to Australia to dig only for gold? British empire can hold treaties over China still?

China has always took the path that the people and development comes first and military is their to safeguard and defend them. Chinese people don't think the same as western people, we have different priorities and values.

I think you are missing the whole point. If you want peace doesn't mean big bully will just stay at one side leaving you alone when you are glamourous with all the gold around you but you don't even have a big gun with you.

Powerful military with projection power ensure continue stability and growth. Imagine,next few month Saudi declare they are not going to sell anymore oil no matter how much u pay them? Australia declare , they are not going to export any mineral resources to China too at any price.

What do u think will happen to China stock market? No to mention the word 'Growth'. In these ever chaning world. Its hard to predict the next step, and what will happen?
My example might be a bit too extreme but I hope China will be well prepare for such scenario in the next 10 years with military to strike anywhere and ensure stability in any part of the world.

Growth is the key for China stability. Military projection might is one of the key ingredient for sustaining this growth.

 

[tch1972]

I don't think that this is necessarily the case. Current Fifth gen fighters are extremely expensive to build and maintain which is why I think Fourth Generation fighters (4.5 and 4++) will serve as the backbone of most air forces for the next two decades or so. There is a reason that planes like the Eurofighter and Su-35 are still being developed.

I am also interested in whether it is feasible to make the J-10 "stealthy" along the veins of the Silent Eagle. For all we know a stealthy variant of the J-10 may be one of the many planes in the J-XX program and may be the best platform to test technology like the AESA radar and internal weapons bay for the dedicated Stealth Fighter.

In the initial stage, most air force will operate with a mixture of 4th gen and 3rd gen fighters. Eventually structural fatigue would have force the retirement of 3rd gen jet like F-16 and most AF will be sourcing for it replacement before that happen. I think that will be around 20 years from now. Much will depends on the cost effectiveness of 4th gen jets like F-35 compare to F-15SE or Eurofighter which is also very expensive. And not many countries that traditionally used American planes will want to buy Russian jets.

 

[rhino123]

I think you are missing the whole point. If you want peace doesn't mean big bully will just stay at one side leaving you alone when you are glamourous with all the gold around you but you don't even have a big gun with you.

Powerful military with projection power ensure continue stability and growth. Imagine,next few month Saudi declare they are not going to sell anymore oil no matter how much u pay them? Australia declare , they are not going to export any mineral resources to China too at any price.

What do u think will happen to China stock market? No to mention the word 'Growth'. In these ever chaning world. Its hard to predict the next step, and what will happen?
My example might be a bit too extreme but I hope China will be well prepare for such scenario in the next 10 years with military to strike anywhere and ensure stability in any part of the world.

Growth is the key for China stability. Military projection might is one of the key ingredient for sustaining this growth.

True. Military projection and strenght is very important in many sense, and it would ensure the country's capability to defend herself aganist all adversary. However military growth must be in line with economy growth and not the other way round.

China's current power projection as compared to many of the western countries such as US, England, France and most probably Germany, is still not on par... especially as compared to US.

To have massive number of J-10 and keeping them in China is not a way to do things. It would still go back to the basic principal that China would fight the war within her own land.

However if she has more carriers, she might be able to bring battles away from motherland.

The reason for US to have so many F-16 and F-15 was not to keep those assets in homeland, but to deploy them overseas in foreign land. US had throughout the years build up huge number of foreign bases either by international diplomatic moves or bullying them into submission, but China do not have that luxury.

So from what I can see, China's number of J-10 is adequate at this moment. they should be equiping themselves with carriers and carrier capable fighters like the Su-33 (or China's equivalent), J-10X (carrier capable J-10) rather than build huge number of J-10 as suggested by someone (not you of course) from this forum.

Therefore the key to power projection was not J-10, it would be future CBG, nuclear subs, long-range strategic bombers and LPD. and as a useful deterrence against enemies of Motherland would be all the DF series of tactical missiles, ASBM, ASAT, DF-31A and future ballistic and cruise missiles.

J-10 is only good for defending motherland from foreign aggressors and most probably used in battle with Taiwan, SK and Japan in future scenarios (if it come to past) because of her limited range.

 

[Gallaghan36]

I agree with Lion. A powerful military guarantees a nation's peace and stability, and if balanced properly with domestic concerns and economic development, China could have both a military equal to USA but at the same time less intervening in other nation's affairs unlike USA. Plus, we never know what will happen in the future(US preemptive strike on China might seem absurd but we never know what tech USA will have in the future that makes them less deterred to attack China than now)so China must beef up its military to defend their nation.

Anyway on topic, 200 J-10s seem a decent number, considering that it just entered PLAAF service 6 years ago. Now that China has 200 J-10s and nearly 300 J-11s, Su-27s and Su-30s, that means that PLAAF now has nearly 500 4th generation fighters. That far surpasses the number in each of Japan, Taiwan, India, and South Korea's air forces.

 

[rhino123]

I agree with Lion. A powerful military guarantees a nation's peace and stability, and if balanced properly with domestic concerns and economic development, China could have both a military equal to USA but at the same time less intervening in other nation's affairs unlike USA. Plus, we never know what will happen in the future(US preemptive strike on China might seem absurd but we never know what tech USA will have in the future that makes them less deterred to attack China than now)so China must beef up its military to defend their nation.

Anyway on topic, 200 J-10s seem a decent number, considering that it just entered PLAAF service 6 years ago. Now that China has 200 J-10s and nearly 300 J-11s, Su-27s and Su-30s, that means that PLAAF now has nearly 500 4th generation fighters. That far surpasses the number in each of Japan, Taiwan, India, and South Korea's air forces.

I see... you are only interested in military hardware quantity instead of looking at quality. By your simple comparison, it seemed that you are very easily led to the CHina threat trap.

By this, I mean, you don't look at the strenght of a country's military by just looking at how many planes or tanks she have. Before the first GW, Iraq boast to have the fourth largest number of tanks... they don't stand a chance.

China might have that much number of planes, but what about her pilots and the people behind that plan the war.

I am not saying that CHina is weak or what... it is just something that we do not know. And so it is simply irresponsible for you to state something like, china had 500 whatever fighters, far greater than any other neighbouring nations... if that statement means nothing, don't say it. If you mean to say that is better, then you are seriously thinking things too easy.

 

[no_name]

A question about PLAAF aircraft numbering:

Is red numbering reserved for test planes while yellow (slight orange colour) numbers are for operational units? I saw some old J-10 pics and they are in red. Also old museum J-7 and J-8 pieces are numbered in red.

Where as the operational J-10, JH-7 and some J-8s seems to have yellow numbering. But some J-8 and old JH-7 pictures also have red numbering. J-11 on the other have have smaller number in black.

Or was it to separate aircraft entering service beyond a certain date, like numbering aircrafts after year 2000 in yellow?

Or are they simply different colours for different areas/commands?
I feel yellow is reserved for planes already assigned to regiments.

Just curious

 

[tphuang]

some recent photos of J-10s, one showing 4 from the 24th division and the other 2 are showing the August 1st demonstration team.

 

[Semi-Lobster]

some recent photos of J-10s, one showing 4 from the 24th division and the other 2 are showing the August 1st demonstration team.

So they decided to go with the blue? Not very Chinese IMO, I like the Red layouts colour schemes better.

 

[siegecrossbow]

So they decided to go with the blue? Not very Chinese IMO, I like the Red layouts colour schemes better.

Especially hilarious since it isn't just blue, it is red, white, and blue. :roll: