I agree that proxies are not good idea. But Western nations are the ones who bred this concept. Why NATO is not fighting Russia directly? NATO was not too late in Libya, US led bloc was quick in Afghanistan, Iraq. Not a single NATO boot in Ukraine?
Israeli-Palestinian Conflict and other Related Conflicts in the Middle East (read the rules in the first post)
- Thread starter phrozenflame
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Left out the second part:
The second part's source is the ESS survey which yielded these results:
The source for the first part is a website called "MyJewishLearning" part of 70 Faces Media which describes itself as "70 Faces Media is the largest and most diverse Jewish media organization in North America." Which itself is a merger with "Jewish Telegraphic Agency". JTA founded the "Overseas New Agency" in 1940 in cooperation with MI6 to provide British spies with press credentials and plant fake news stores in US newspapers to counter Hitler. This is proudly recalled in another Jewish site "Forward.com".
"MyJewishLearning" was created by Edgar M. Bronfman and funding continued through "The Samuel Bronfman Foundation". The family fame started with Samuel Bronfman, the most influential Jew in Canada, who made his fortune during Prohibition by producing alcohol in Canada and smuggling it into the US where it was illegal using organized crime as the middlemen.
The founding/funding circle also includes:
The Diane and Guilford Glazer Foundation. Of it, the Israel Policy Forum says:
It's director is "Shira Efron" who, according to CNAS [was]
Crown Family Philanthropies. The founders also created Material Service Corp, acquired General Dynamics, and merged the two together. The current president Evan Hochberg used to be a Director at Deloitte which is known for several savory things, one of which was specifically hiring former CIA employees.
There's more but I'm honestly tired of looking up who their various funders are. For example another funder is the Maimonides Fund, whose President is also leading the Birthright Israel Foundation. Birthright Israel Foundation is also a funder of the Jim Joseph Foundation, which also happens to fund 70 Faces Media. And the Maimonides Fund promotes articles equating Gaza with Hamas and destroying Hamas. Birthright Israel Foundation is exactly what it sounds like too.
I checked simply because both the paper and the website don't cite any sources for the first part's numbers. But if we take the website's word for it:
So regardless of whether of not they were European, they're still settlers.
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"Compromised" how? Compromised on pan-Muslim unity, yes. But that never mattered as it never happened, it was all a mirage to fool their people. What's funny is that their people really believe in all that crap lmao
IMO the Arab countries are doing ok. Each leader serves his country's national interest. What's to gain from provoking the US to bomb them to smithereens to help Palestinians?
Don't forget that now the number 1 pressing concern for Saudi Arabia and others is to diversify their economies away from oil (gas is more long-term) and towards other industries so that they don't collapse due to the decarbonisation of the world economy.
I think people have a romanticized view of how much arab unity means in the face of geopolitical realities. Even now Saudi is happy to resume normalization of relations with Israel after they finish dealing with Gaza.
No , people have a romanticized view of something because they want to see it in their own way. The Arab unity never existed, because that is a western concept . You see the Europe, how many of them is in perfect unity? How was it before common cause of Russia in Ukraine? Europeans created US, it has been 2 centuries. Still there is interracial fighting across the board. They do not even have barrier of language or border. The unity we talk about is unity under one God & Religion across all countries,continents regardless of race , borders or language, to function as one. It was described to be hard to achieve otherwise it would have never been mentioned.
People describe their romanticized view in words to feel it as real,then they build a virtual reality around it, and use it as part of their arguments to further reinforce their hypothesis, and with time they get so lost in their hypothesis that they forget it was based on their own false romanticized view.
Gotta admit they probably have the most influential military in the region.
What about the Palestinians? Aren't they just Jewish people who have converted to Islam?
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You could also check official state census data if you go looking for it. The fact that 60% of Israeli Jews are Mizrahim is not a subject of historical controversy.
Im not interested in getting into another debate about this, but suffice it to say you should think critically about why almost a million Jews across the middle east near-simultaneously decided to uproot their lives and abandon what property they had to move to an embattled Israel. People who are doing well and have little to worry about do not do that kind of thing.
@Minm No. Basically all Jews were expulsed by Rome in the first century CE and the area remained overwhelmingly non-Jewish until Israel's founding. I am not an expert in what happened in between but I know that the area definitely wasn't Jewish during the initial spread of Islam.
Actually, no you can't. Because the Israel government census data is blocked to people outside of Israel due to the Israel-Hamas conflict.
If you can get their pages to load through stuff like web.archive, you'll be greeted with this:
Even then, most articles wouldn't be able to cite the CBS figures, given the Mizrahim category didn't even exist in CBS's statistics. They announced they would start compiling that data in Sept of last year.
But we can get that data through other methods:
The paper from 2017 says:
This is written by "Stiftung Wissenschaft und Politik", which is a German think tank that advises the Bundestag. Would think they have their numbers correct.
There's also an interesting graph in "From Haven to Heaven" by Israelite sociologist Yinon Cohen which seems to be dervied from tabulation of per-year immigration numbers.
That doesn't read 60% even in the past, how curious...
Actually, the 2nd source goes into this. Post WW2, the ME was in the process of decolonization and that meant newly formed Arab nations were trying to figure out their identities; whether it was an religious or ethnic/secular identity. It was in this backdrop that Israel was created and the Zionist began persecuting the Palestinians.
In response to this persecution, voices calling for an identity based on religion (Islam) began to gain in strength and these Arabs demonstrated their beliefs by persecuting the Jewish in their countries. Zionists then used this counter-reaction to argue and implement even more brutal persecution in Israel/Palestine. The pro-religious identity Arabs gained even more strength and continued the cycle.
So Israel started the fire and fanned it, creating the conditions for the mass migration of Jews out of the Arab countries. Why did the Jews never try to migrate out of those Arab countries prior to the creation of Israel? It because conditions never got that bad until the Zionists came into the picture.