Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

plawolf said:

Sukhoi's cash surplus is a very recent development. Whether that makes up for the many years of under-investment in all aspects of the Russian aviation and hi-tech industries after the collapse of the USSR or the limited funding the Russian military had to spend remains to be seen.

The PAKFA has already slipped a year on the scheduled IOC of 2015, and I would not at all be surprised if there are more slippages on the schedule, and I would be amazed if the Indians are not asked to fork out more than originally agreed before they get any birds.

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plawolf said:

If they are doing it, then they have it arse backwards in more ways than one.

Firstly, only small and militarily weak nations use weapons purchases as a tool of diplomacy by using their purchases as a token of their felty, and as such, they are paying for more than mere arms with their silver. That is why few non-American companies put in more than a token effort when US vassal states like South Korea or Japan put out major arms tenders, and those who forget and actually put in real effort and money into trying to win the deals always come away disappointed and angry.

Real powers use weapons sales as tool for diplomacy. That is the first way that the Indian approach is arse backwards.

Secondly, the golden rule of any nation that wants to remain free and prosperous is that you don't screw around with national defence. The Chinese once forgot that and paid for that folly with a century of death, humiliation and suffering. It is a lesson most dearly learnt and one unlikely to be forgotten again in a hurry.

You use commercial contracts for diplomacy, but you should never ever compromise your own national security by picking weapons based on anything other than the merits of those weapons and how well they fit within your overall defence strategy and structure. That is why for all the closeness between China and Pakistan, Pakistan have always favoured western equipment and systems in the past, and are only switch to Chinese gear after careful evaluation and conclusion that the Chinese kit has come of age and suit their needs as well as, if not better than anything the west cares to offer.

The only exception to that rule is when, as pointed out in point 1 above, if you are paying for more than just the arms when you make a big ticket weapons purchase.

I do agree with you that logistics is the Indian military's great Achilles Heel, and has said so many times before. Any country that has fought a real war will know full well that logistics are just as important, if not more so than your soldiers and generals when it comes to winning wars. Many a great general has been humbled throughout history by poor logistics.

All I have seen thus far has only reinforced by belief that the Indians do not understand or appreciate this most basic reality of war. Their leaders care too much about the paper specs of weapons and bragging rights certain status symbol weapons grant them, and not enough about how well those weapons suit their own needs or how to keep those weapons supplied with munitions during war, never mind the issue of attrition replacements or how to boost their fighting strength in a protracted conflict.

The Indian military as it stands is built for peace and the kinds of small, short low intensity conflicts against a far weaker foe that would end before logistics becomes a real concern. While it might look impressive on paper at first glance, as soon as you take a closer look, the fundamental flaws become readily apparent, as does a near fool-proof strategy of how to defeat it - logistics.

The Indian military would fold all by itself if an opponent can sustain intensive combat operations for more than a few weeks irrespective of actual combat exchange ratios. India's own generals realise this plain enough. Which is why they came up with the ridiculous idea of knocking China out of a two-front war involving Pakistan in 72 hours.

That was driven as much by desperation as it is by hubris, and is less a case of India thinking it can actually knock China out in 72hours, but more than India has to knock China out of the war ASAP or else its game over for them.

The similarities and resemblance between India's position and those of Japan's per-Pearl Harbour are starkly similar, and I fear a grave Indian miscalculation in the event of all out war between India and Pakistan, with India deciding it needs to launch a surprise attack not unlike Pearl Harbour to try and knock China out of the war before it can get involved.

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MwRYum said:

That's why the Indians are finding - and have found - kindred spirits in the Japanese leadership. Just look at how close India and Japan are getting along, and Japanese politicians are whipping up a tide that another Sino-Japanese War is just a matter of "when", not "if".

Leaders in Tokyo and New Deli are dreaming the same dream of defeating China, then carve it up amongst themselves.

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plawolf said:

Yes, I do think China would have said 'no' even if offered, just like how they said 'no' when the Russians offered them in on the PAKFA.

.......
All in all, China may well have spend just as much if not more than what India forked out on the Vikra effectively rebuilding the Varyag into the Liaoning and pretty much setting up a carrier construction industry. However, that was worth it for the Chinese because the exercise and expense spent with the Liaoning has set up a domestic carrier industry for China, and China can and will make more, better carriers than the Liaoning with the knowledge, experience and industrial base it has established in her rebuilding.
........

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MwRYum said:

Leaders in Tokyo and New Deli are dreaming the same dream of defeating China, then carve it up amongst themselves.

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paintgun said:

Thats quite a generalisation

Actually when talking about Indian military, I find the need to separate the Indian Armed Forces and the GoI
The first I have a healthy dose of respect with, as any military branch of any nation, and the later a total clusterfuck of dimwits, as any government branch of any nation.

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antiterror13 said:

May I add something very important? Even if China spent on Liaoning more than the Indians, REMEMBER the money they spent would be circulated within China and would even add much more to its GDP (multiplier effect) ... while for India, the money would be circulated only in Russia and nothing in India (apart from bribery from Russia to a few Indian officials)

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paintgun said:

Money is not important in this game, its the knowledge, experience and expertise
Something money can't buy even if you have lots of money, wink wink India

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