Hong Kong....Occupy Central Demonstrations....

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cn_habs

cn_habs

Junior Member
Bltizo said:
Call me a cynic, but I think a good proportion of the ultra rich chinese seeking to move abroad are doing so because they know they have dirty money.
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99% of those people are dirty and everyone knows it.

Back to the topic, the longer they stay in the streets to disrupt the local financial sector and tourism, the more other Chinese coastal cities and Singapore benefit. Democracy is a nice concept for the 1% to keep the middle class content but doesn't put bread on the table. Those who call in sick to demonstrate will eventually go back or lose their livehoods whereas those demanding students who has missed a chunk of the semester will be disadvantaged compared to their peers or even foreign competition.
 
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airsuperiority

Captain
pla101prc said:
well i hope you are right
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thanks. I will take your words as support and I'm sure we all thank you for the support. we don't argue or protestors just for the sake of it. even more we don't want fallout with Beijing, just our own rights for a proper election. regardless, I hope for the best, and that's the only way I can support my people back home. plus, a good ending goes good for both sides
 
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texx1

Junior Member
joshuatree said:
Direct trade has been implemented for quite some time already. What China lacks that HK still has is what others have said, a level of transparency and legal framework that international companies factor in. You may say as long as there is money to be made, they will come. But that has a ceiling where the costs will outweigh the benefits at some point for any corporation. Then things plateau and may even slide backwards. Let's not forget other countries in the area are not stagnant, they will vie for the business too. Chinese corporations are starting to stretch out to other countries but they will soon learn what works within China won't necessarily work elsewhere because the level of transparency and legal framework elsewhere will make their method of operation unacceptable. So until the day when all Chinese cities have the same level of legal framework and transparency, HK will still have an edge. As quality of life improves, people in other Chinese cities will naturally start demanding the same. Look at how the lack of food quality control, pollution control, and legal recourse would bring up discontent in other Chinese cities. Why do so many Chinese who can afford it try to find a way to emigrate? To protect their assets in places with stronger transparency and legal frameworks?

Beijing actually will have greater ease in convincing Taiwan if it affords more flexibility.
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Mainland China as a market is just too large for foreign firms to avoid. For example Hollywood are constantly wanting show more movies in China even when intellectual property is not very well respected And I am sure the development of legal frameworks in China would not become stagnant since Beijing is very serious about its economic developments. And I agree that more flexibility on Beijing's part will help convincing Taiwan. But the point is whether Beijing sees it as absolute necessary. I guess we will find out.
 
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airsuperiority

Captain
Blackstone said:
That is not how the Western lame stream media report the Hong Kong protest; you'd think HK had full democracy already and China is trying to take it away. While I have no problem blaming the Communist Overlords for ills they perpetrate, they shouldn't be held accountable by kneejerk reflex either. If it's bad, let's say it's bad, and if it's good, let's say it's good. Call a spade a spade.
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im always for fair journalism
 
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texx1

Junior Member
joshuatree said:
Or it could be new businesses that never existed without a Shanghai FTZ. Opening new centers of commerce isn't just about stealing businesses from existing places, it's also about being a driver in creating new opportunities. Otherwise, there should be no such thing as an economy growing, merely a perpetual shuffling of the same economy.
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But you can't be certain Shanghai and HK will complement each other like fish and water. There will definitely be competitions. And what happens when business is slow?
 
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airsuperiority

Captain
Blackstone said:
Excuse me, Air, but what does the part in bold means? If pla101prc is correct, then HK's agreement with Beijing never gave it full democracy. Is that true from your understanding? If so, what exactly is Beijing trying to take away?
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thank you for the question. Ohh that just means that deep inside I know this struggle isn't gonna be easy and there's a high chance of failure and nothing happen, but I cant give up hope on my people.
to be honest, the sino-British joint declaration stated Beijing will not get involved in the political autonomy and processes of hk, sor what Beijing is doing is backtracking on its words. however please gimme a few hours to study the stuffs. I will give you a more solid and steady answer once I understand it all.

if I recall correctly, what China is doing will be taking away full political autonomy from hk in terms of true election, as promised. however lemme look into it
 
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Brumby

Brumby

Major
texx1 said:
Sure it can. But that still means HK will be getting 50% of the business while before Shangha FTZ, it could have gotten 100%. This is an over simplification. The percentage won't be likely that. Still any businesses gained by Shanghai could mean potentially business lost in HK.
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You are assuming zero sum neutrality. In an economic model, is the country's economic growth a result of the gateway or is it mutually cooperative towards the growth? The latter supports a net positive zero sum environment.
 
Brumby

Brumby

Major
texx1 said:
But you can't be certain Shanghai and HK will complement each other like fish and water. There will definitely be competitions. And what happens when business is slow?
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Competition breeds efficiency and efficiency removes waste.
 
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texx1

Junior Member
Brumby said:
You are assuming zero sum neutrality. In an economic model, is the country's economic growth a result of the gateway or is it mutually cooperative towards the growth? The latter supports a net positive zero sum environment.
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I merely trying to illustrate there will be competitions between financial centers. It's too early to see whether Shanghai and HK will be mutually cooperative. If Beijing did want Shanghai and HK to be mutually cooperative, would its calculation change after OC protest in Hong Kong. Simply put would Beijing be as generous to HK as before?
 
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SamuraiBlue

SamuraiBlue

Captain
texx1 said:
But you can't be certain Shanghai and HK will complement each other like fish and water. There will definitely be competitions. And what happens when business is slow?
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I speculate that there will be no difference between Shanghai and HK in the long run if Beijing forces the same rules to HK driving many foreign investors to relocate their main base to places like Singapore and maintain a small secretariat offices which they can cut loose when things get worse like the present anti-trust shame Beijing is campaigning targeting foreign car makers.

Beijing could have orchestrated a better election scheme with universal suffrage in place with favorable outcomes by placing various choke points on how political parties can be organized with nominees can only be appointed by political parties and/or place various limitations and check points to the elected official instead of acting irrationally and arrogantly stating Beijing has final word on selection of officials.
 
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