Hong Kong....Occupy Central Demonstrations....

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ancestral

New Member
The table has really turned. On major forums such as BabyKingdom (where moms discuss things about their children), uwants, and discuss, people are condemning Pan-dem, OC 3 and the students for pulling their antics. On facebook, people are disclosing the addresses and phone numbers of OC3, Jimmy Lai and Wong Chi Fung, asking people to occupy their home.

10658954_716103875145388_6453704760785655458_o.jpg
Caption: Protesters stopped and searched an ambulance before letting it pass. Things like this pissed off a lot of HK citizens.

In another news, 3 men and 2 women (The Anonymous lol) aged between 13 to 39 are caught distributing malicious software to hack government websites.

商業罪案調查科科凌晨採取行動,拘捕5人,涉攻擊政府網站。針對近日有人在網上提供電腦程式,供其他人下載以攻擊政府網站,商罪科科技罪案組經調查後,今凌晨約1時採取行動,突擊搜查北角、元朗、黃大仙及柴灣區4個單位,拘捕3男兩女,年齡介乎13至39歲,涉嫌有犯罪或不誠實意圖而取用電腦。被捕男女現正被扣查。

It is looking more and more like a total defeat for the OC camp.
 

MwRYum

Major
The table has really turned. On major forums such as BabyKingdom (where moms discuss things about their children), uwants, and discuss, people are condemning Pan-dem, OC 3 and the students for pulling their antics. On facebook, people are disclosing the addresses and phone numbers of OC3, Jimmy Lai and Wong Chi Fung, asking people to occupy their home.

View attachment 10488
Caption: Protesters stopped and searched an ambulance before letting it pass. Things like this pissed off a lot of HK citizens.

In another news, 3 men and 2 women (The Anonymous lol) aged between 13 to 39 are caught distributing malicious software to hack government websites.



It is looking more and more like a total defeat for the OC camp.

Nah, "total defeat" would be roads are finally reopened and all them insurgents are tied down to a kneeling position, lined along the road to suck exhaust fumes...but that still ain't happening, as roads are still closed, and "Yellow Guards" still insulting the police and anyone who oppose their "revolution".

Babykingdom forum is traditionally conservative leaning, the other two I don't know for sure, but HK Golden is traditionally the bastion of anti-government faction. So I'm not surprised such turn when this fiasco drags on and its demerits are for all to see.
 

broadsword

Brigadier
The table has really turned. On major forums such as BabyKingdom (where moms discuss things about their children), uwants, and discuss, people are condemning Pan-dem, OC 3 and the students for pulling their antics. On facebook, people are disclosing the addresses and phone numbers of OC3, Jimmy Lai and Wong Chi Fung, asking people to occupy their home.

Just occupying their toilets would do.
 

Third_Echelon

Just Hatched
Registered Member
The table has really turned. On major forums such as BabyKingdom (where moms discuss things about their children), uwants, and discuss, people are condemning Pan-dem, OC 3 and the students for pulling their antics. On facebook, people are disclosing the addresses and phone numbers of OC3, Jimmy Lai and Wong Chi Fung, asking people to occupy their home.

LOL oh how the tables have turned! Let them have a taste of their own medicine.
 

ancestral

New Member
This happened on Mongkok, showing the OC protesters flinging profanity and taunting police officers.

[video=youtube;jXLdQJ_a2hQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXLdQJ_a2hQ&feature=youtu.be[/video]
 

MightySnake

Just Hatched
Registered Member
An opinion from FT.

Hong Kong should focus its fight on the tycoon economy
By Joe Studwell

The real target is the anti-competitive, anti-consumer economy, writes Joe Studwell

Hong Kong stepped back from the brink on Thursday night, when chief executive CY Leung belatedly authorised a senior official to “hold talks” with protesters and those same protesters decided, for now, not to enter government buildings. It was a fortunate outcome. Beijing would characterise the occupation of official property as an attack on the Chinese state.

What Hong Kong needs is not a strategy that backs Xi Jinping, the Chinese president, into a corner, but one that resonates with his own mindset. This is why the protesters should refocus on Hong Kong’s tycoon economy, and the anti-competitive, anti-consumer arrangements that define it. You may think, like the Heritage Foundation, that Hong Kong is a free market. However, except for external trade, it is not. Instead it is what one of the richest men in the city once described to me as “a nice bowl of fish soup”. That soup is fed to the few, making ordinary people poorer, stoking resentment, and indirectly contributing to acute pollution.

Cartels are everywhere in Hong Kong. Supermarkets are a duopoly, one whose pricing power allows the chains to charge higher prices for the same products in some of Hong Kong’s most deprived areas. Drug stores are a duopoly. Buses are a cartel: high-priced, mostly cash-only, running shoddy, dirty diesel vehicles with drivers who earn a pittance. Electricity is provided by two, expensive monopolies that handle everything from generation to distribution, one on Hong Kong island and the other in Kowloon. The container ports are an oligopoly, with the world’s highest handling charges. Yet they will not supply onshore electricity to vessels, which must instead run diesel generators that pollute the city air.

The biggest stitch-up remains the lousy construction standards and sky-high costs in a residential property market dominated by the “Four Families”, which in the 1990s were estimated to be selling property for between two and four times what it cost to develop.

You may think of the territory as a free market but, except for external trade, it is not

Add in the jiggery-pokery of a Boys’ Own stock market with 1970s-style governance, and a taxation system that tycoons circumvent by taking out their money through tax-free dividends, and you begin to get the picture.

Hong Kong has had a Competition Ordinance and a Competition Commission since 2012. But so far nothing has changed. In a striking contrast with mainland China, where the Communist party after 1989 first increased transfer payments to the urban poor, and then increased transfers and cut taxes for the rural poor in the 2000s, the Hong Kong government lets a colonial rentier economy carry merrily on.

Mr Xi launched his new administration with not only a brutal anti-corruption campaign, but also an anti-monopoly drive. Unfortunately he seems unaware that Hong Kong is at least as rigged as the mainland.

So here is a plan. Speak to Mr Xi in terms he understands. Refocus the protests on the cartels. I am no protester, but it is not hard to think of peaceful tactics that would be difficult for the tycoons to ignore as they sweep into their basement car parks and ascend in private elevators to their penthouse offices. Where possible, boycott the cartels.

Would this be the end for the tycoons? Not at all. In my experience they are people of extraordinary entrepreneurial acumen. Like all of us, they enjoy a capacious free lunch. But if that is taken away they will adjust and add more value to the economy by doing so.

It is time for Hong Kong to work for the majority. If the protesters make Mr Xi understand the economic problem, it becomes easier to compromise on the politics – probably with a more open nomination process in 2022. I hold, perhaps wrongly, that Beijing’s intransigence is born of ignorance, not malice.

The writer is author of ‘How Asia Works: success and failure in the world’s most dynamic region’
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
I think democracy is just a means to an end for these OC radicals; to destroy the economic freedom of HK.

I don't think it comes as a surprise that OC is really just another version of your typical Occupy protest a while back but I think that OC is much more cunning. OC is able to use democracy as a shield to cover their hidden agenda, which is this western left wing socialist, redistributionist policies which is so contradictory to Hong Kong's long standing view of positive non-intervention which started with HK's financial secretary John James Cowperthwaite and upheld by successive financial secretaries.

Common viewpoints from the OC side:

-People should sacrifice some of their wages for the greater good
-Business owners who don't agree with this movement and are concerned about lost business are scumbags
-It's our parents' generations fault, they bought flats when they were a lot less expensive and have their mortgage paid off
-Our parents don't get the big picture, they don't know anything so therefore they are wrong

I don't know if OC sees the irony in their views but gee....it sounds like cultural revolution rhetoric!

Milton Friedman got it right when he said that economic freedom should come before (or is more important than) political freedom and he is right. People will never support for any policy where their economic freedom or prosperity is at risk and I think we are witnessing this right now with the anti-OC protestors in HK.

The so-called "Occupy," movement in the US was an abject failure. It exposed the agenda for the people behind it as anti-economic and the very things you speak of here.

If these people want to elecit support in the US from the main stream populace, then adopting the "OC," name and image was the wrong way to go about it.

Generally, the Occupy Movement demonstrations in the US were rife with far left rhetoric, illicit drugs, sexual predators amongst their own, and a bunch of young people who have bought into the "entitlement," mentality of the left where they are being used to try and bring down and destroy free enterprise and the free market because they want to label it "unfair."

Most Americans pretty much ignored it to begin with...it was never a very large movement in the first place...but as it went on, and as they committed crimes against businesses, and amongst themselves, people became appalled at it, and for the most part, very negative towards it. Ultimately it p[retty much just fizzled out here.

I cannot speak to all of the nuances in Hong Kong. I cannot speak to what the original protestors over the election may or may not have had as their overall agenda. I have visited Hong Kong in the past, but it was still under British Rule the first time, and then later under the PRC. The only difference I noticed was a decided less friendly attitude of the people going administering customs...but that could have been anything, including a "bad day," on the job for the people working that day. Purely ancedotal.

I do know that adopting the Occupy name was a mistake. It may garner these protestors some support and sympathy with the far left in the US and elsewhere, but by and large, with the vast majority of the people who have to work for a living, it will not garner them any support at all. If people here think hat they are the same ilk as the "Occupy," protestors in the US were, the people will have little patience and no sympathy for them.
 

delft

Brigadier
An opinion from FT.

Hong Kong should focus its fight on the tycoon economy
By Joe Studwell

The real target is the anti-competitive, anti-consumer economy, writes Joe Studwell

Hong Kong stepped back from the brink on Thursday night, when chief executive CY Leung belatedly authorised a senior official to “hold talks” with protesters and those same protesters decided, for now, not to enter government buildings. It was a fortunate outcome. Beijing would characterise the occupation of official property as an attack on the Chinese state.

What Hong Kong needs is not a strategy that backs Xi Jinping, the Chinese president, into a corner, but one that resonates with his own mindset. This is why the protesters should refocus on Hong Kong’s tycoon economy, and the anti-competitive, anti-consumer arrangements that define it. You may think, like the Heritage Foundation, that Hong Kong is a free market. However, except for external trade, it is not. Instead it is what one of the richest men in the city once described to me as “a nice bowl of fish soup”. That soup is fed to the few, making ordinary people poorer, stoking resentment, and indirectly contributing to acute pollution.

Cartels are everywhere in Hong Kong. Supermarkets are a duopoly, one whose pricing power allows the chains to charge higher prices for the same products in some of Hong Kong’s most deprived areas. Drug stores are a duopoly. Buses are a cartel: high-priced, mostly cash-only, running shoddy, dirty diesel vehicles with drivers who earn a pittance. Electricity is provided by two, expensive monopolies that handle everything from generation to distribution, one on Hong Kong island and the other in Kowloon. The container ports are an oligopoly, with the world’s highest handling charges. Yet they will not supply onshore electricity to vessels, which must instead run diesel generators that pollute the city air.

The biggest stitch-up remains the lousy construction standards and sky-high costs in a residential property market dominated by the “Four Families”, which in the 1990s were estimated to be selling property for between two and four times what it cost to develop.

You may think of the territory as a free market but, except for external trade, it is not

Add in the jiggery-pokery of a Boys’ Own stock market with 1970s-style governance, and a taxation system that tycoons circumvent by taking out their money through tax-free dividends, and you begin to get the picture.

Hong Kong has had a Competition Ordinance and a Competition Commission since 2012. But so far nothing has changed. In a striking contrast with mainland China, where the Communist party after 1989 first increased transfer payments to the urban poor, and then increased transfers and cut taxes for the rural poor in the 2000s, the Hong Kong government lets a colonial rentier economy carry merrily on.

Mr Xi launched his new administration with not only a brutal anti-corruption campaign, but also an anti-monopoly drive. Unfortunately he seems unaware that Hong Kong is at least as rigged as the mainland.

So here is a plan. Speak to Mr Xi in terms he understands. Refocus the protests on the cartels. I am no protester, but it is not hard to think of peaceful tactics that would be difficult for the tycoons to ignore as they sweep into their basement car parks and ascend in private elevators to their penthouse offices. Where possible, boycott the cartels.

Would this be the end for the tycoons? Not at all. In my experience they are people of extraordinary entrepreneurial acumen. Like all of us, they enjoy a capacious free lunch. But if that is taken away they will adjust and add more value to the economy by doing so.

It is time for Hong Kong to work for the majority. If the protesters make Mr Xi understand the economic problem, it becomes easier to compromise on the politics – probably with a more open nomination process in 2022. I hold, perhaps wrongly, that Beijing’s intransigence is born of ignorance, not malice.

The writer is author of ‘How Asia Works: success and failure in the world’s most dynamic region’
The financial economy, in short hand called Wall Street, is also rigged for those with power and detrimental for the 99%. Mr Xi probably likes to show to the mainlanders how much better a regulated economy is, especially one improved by his anti-corruption campaign, than the capitalist economy of Hong Kong.
 
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