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Pointblank

Senior Member
There is one problem with this idea. The Americans don't need or want these ships. And the European nations are facing economic and financial distress and are facing cuts in their military budgets. They don't have the money to buy or operate these ships. Who is going to buy these white elephants ?

Under this proposal, it would be a pooled asset, like the NATO E-3's. Theoretically, a NATO amphib would be registered and based in one country, but would have a multinational crew. The ship would then be deployed anywhere where NATO agrees to deploy the ship, escorted by NATO escort ships.
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
DCNS has bagged a huge submarine order from Brazil which includes a nuclear powered submarine

Big bucks for France they are so good when it comes to naval exports always get the big ticket items beating BAE

FFG for Saudi Arabia, Taiwan, Morocco and Singapore
Corvettes for UAE and Turkey
Lots and lots of Patrol crafts too many to list
SSK to Malaysia, Pakistan, Spain, Chile, Brazil and India I mean they have exported 23 SSKs

Now they got the 2 x LHD exports for Russia and a SSN order plus a carrier also from Brazil

If France wants to be serious they should not have cancelled the second carrier they spent $198 million just on the feasibility studies and scrapped the thing plus they cancelled the 4th Mistral Class

That would give French navy 2 x CVN plus 4 x LHD second only to USN wow that's a serious force
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
If France wants to be serious they should not have cancelled the second carrier they spent $198 million just on the feasibility studies and scrapped the thing plus they cancelled the 4th Mistral Class

That would give French navy 2 x CVN plus 4 x LHD second only to USN wow that's a serious force
But... they didn't build them, so they have the one carrier and the three Mistrals. Even if they had, they would have had six, which means they would be behind the Japanese who soon will have seven.

If you list the nations who have large, full flat-deck aviation/amphib vessels in the world, it will go like this with the current immediate build plans:

US Navy - 21 total
10 Nimitz, 1 Ford, 8 Wasp, 1 Tarawa, 1 America

Japan - 7 total
2 Izumo, 2 Hyuga, 3 Osumi

Italy - 5 total
1 Cavour, 1 Garibaldi, 3 San Giorgio

France - 4 total
1 De Gaulle, 3 - Mistral

UK - 3 Total
2 QE, 1 Ocean

Russia - 3 total
1 Kuznetsov, 2 - Vladivostock

India - 2 total
1 Vikramaditya, 1 Vikrant

Australia - 2 total
2 Canberra

China - 1 total
1 Liaoning

Brazil - 1 total
1 Sao Paulo

Spain - 1 total
1 Juan Carlos

South Korea - 1 total
1 Dokdo

Thailand - 1 total
1 Naruebet

Thats a total of fifty-two large, flat deck aviation/amphibious warships. This does not include LPDs like the San Antonio or Type 071s.
 

Brumby

Major
Under this proposal, it would be a pooled asset, like the NATO E-3's. Theoretically, a NATO amphib would be registered and based in one country, but would have a multinational crew. The ship would then be deployed anywhere where NATO agrees to deploy the ship, escorted by NATO escort ships.

E-3 as a pooled asset is a logical extension of its mission and capabilities. As an eye in the sky, it covers a broad geographical spread of the European continent and hence pooling resources to exploit such a capability makes sense for each country within Nato. In contrast, a Mistral is a more mission focus asset which has less cross appeal across member nations. In a tough fiscal environment, each country as usual will resort to self interest.
 

aksha

Captain
garuda v exercise pictures.it is a bilateral exercise between the freanch air force and indian airforce,presently taking place at jodhpur,rajasthan,india
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French Pilots Fly IAF Flankers & Floggers, Indian Pilots Take Rafales Up At #Garuda5French Pilots Fly IAF Flankers & Floggers, Indian Pilots Take Rafales Up At #Garuda5We don't know yet if French Air Force chief General Denis Mercier (met him last year) will get behind the stick on an IAF Flanker at Garuda-V, but Livefist can confirm that over the last two days, Armée de l'Air pilots definitely have. At least 2 French pilots have done sorties Su-30 MKI and MiG-27s as well. IAF pilots have been taking spins in the 4 Rafales at Jodhpur as well, sources at the base confirmed.
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FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Rafale M40 ( Marine/navy ) 40th delivered, 4 lost and ten first version F1 ( only capable air-air mission and refueling with pod ) stored unavailable will be modernized from this year to standard F3* will be useful to equip Flotilla 17F the last on Super-Etendard ( 12 ) next year, FOC for 2016.
*2 in 2014, 3 in 2015, 4 in 2016 and the last in 2017.

M40 get new radar RBE-2 AESA replace RBE-2 PESA, 1000/1200 modules, effective range increased by about one-third proportion valid for all these new radars, vs fighter 1m2 detection range 128 km, PESA 80, 8 targets engaged simultaneously, PESA 4.

Right now 26 Rafale M F3 in service, 23 for 11F, 12F at Landivisiau ( 48°31'49.00"N 4° 9'6.00"O ) , 2 for Sqn 2/92 training unit jointly operated with French Air Force ( with 6 AF Rafale ) at Saint-Dizier and the last for tests.

Theoretical staffing for a Flotilla 14 fighter, 170 men.

For this year 11 delivered, all month 1 except one summer month, 2 for Navy.

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asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Can you believe Dassault is about to bag that order for 126 fighters?? It's worth absolute billions and I mean billions!!

I bet Dassault is well happy they went for Rafale and not Typhoon they secured a big order right there again France doing big business many Rich Arab nation are looking at Rafale too
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
The Rafael is one of the best gen 4+ aircraft out there. I like to compare it to the SAAB Grippen.


rafale-01.jpg


FRENCH DASSAULT RAFAEL - 126 produced to date

Crew: 1–2
Length: 15.27 m (50.1 ft)
Wingspan: 10.80 m (35.4 ft)
Height: 5.34 m (17.5 ft)
Wing area: 45.7 m² (492 ft²)
Empty weight:
- C: 9,500 kilograms (20,900 lb)
- B: 9,770 kilograms (21,540 lb)
- M: 10,196 kilograms (22,480 lb[193])
Loaded weight: 14,016 kg (30,900 lb)
Max. takeoff weight:
- 24,500 kg (C/D)
- 22,200 kg (M) (54,000 lb)
Powerplant: 2 × Snecma M88-2 turbofans Dry thrust: 50.04 kN (11,250 lbf) each
Thrust with afterburner: 75.62 kN (17,000 lbf) each
Fuel capacity: 4,700 kg (10,360 lb) internal
Maximum speed:
- High altitude: Mach 1.8 (1,912 km/h, 1,032 knots)
- Low altitude: Mach 1.1 (1,390 km/h, 750 knots)
Range: 3,700+ km (2,000+ nmi) with 3 drop tanks
Combat radius: 1,852+ km (1,000+ nmi) on penetration mission
Service ceiling: 15,235 m (50,000 ft)
Rate of climb: 304.8+ m/s (60,000+ ft/min)
Wing loading: 306 kg/m² (62.8 lb/ft²)
Thrust/weight: 0.988 (100% fuel, 2 EM A2A missile, 2 IR A2A missile) version M
Armament:
- Guns: 1× 30 mm (1.18 in) GIAT 30/M791 autocannon with 125 rounds
- Hardpoints: 14 for Air Force versions (Rafale B/C), 13 for Navy version (Rafale M) with a capacity of 9,500 kg (20,900 lb) external fuel and ordnance
Missiles:
- MBDA MICA IR or EM or Magic II and
- MBDA Meteor air-to-air missiles in the future
- Air-to-ground: MBDA Apache or
- Storm Shadow-SCALP EG or AASM-Hammer or
- AM-39-Exocet
Boms:
- GBU-12 Paveway II
- GBU-49 Enhanced Paveway II
- GBU-24 Paveway III
- AS-30L
Nuclear: A
- SMP-A nuclear missile
Other:
Thales Damocles targeting pod
- AREOS (Airborne Recce Observation System)reconnaissance pod
- Up to 5 drop tanks
- Buddy-buddy refuelling pod[60]


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SWEDEN SAAB GRIPPEN JAS 39 - 200 produced to date

Crew: 1 or 2
Payload: 5,300 kg (11,700 lb)
Length: 14.1 m (46 ft 3 in); two-seater: 14.8 m (48 ft 5 in)
Wingspan: 8.4 m (27 ft 7 in)
Height: 4.5 m (14 ft 9 in)
Wing area: 30.0 m² (323 ft²)
Empty weight: 6,800 kg[266] (12,600 lb)
Loaded weight: 8,500 kg (18,700 lb)
Max. takeoff weight: 14,000 kg (31,000 lb)
Powerplant: 1 × Volvo RM12 afterburning turbofan Dry thrust: 54 kN (12,100 lbf)
Thrust with afterburner: 80.5 kN (18,100 lbf)
Maximum speed: Mach 2 (2,204 km/h (1,190 kn; 1,370 mph)) at high altitude
Combat radius: 800 km (497 mi, 432 nmi)
Ferry range: 3,200 km (1,983 mi) with drop tanks
Service ceiling: 15,240 m (50,000 ft)
Wing loading: 283 kg/m² (58 lb/ft²)
Thrust/weight: 0.97
Armament
- Guns: 1× 27 mm Mauser BK-27 Revolver cannon with 120 rounds (single-seat models only)
- Hardpoints: 8 (three on each wing and two under fuselage) and provisions to carry combinations of: Rockets: 4× rocket pods, 13.5 cm rockets
Missiles:
- 6× AIM-9 Sidewinder or IRIS-T
- 4× AIM-120 AMRAAM or MICA
- 4× Meteor
- 4× AGM-65 Maverick
- 2× KEPD.350
- 2× Rbs.15F anti-ship missile
Bombs:
- 4× GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided bomb
- 2× Bk.90 cluster bomb
- 8× Mark 82 bombs
 

thunderchief

Senior Member
Can you believe Dassault is about to bag that order for 126 fighters?? It's worth absolute billions and I mean billions!!

It is not a done deal yet. They keep pushing signing further away to the future. Now they are mentioning March 2015.

The Indian Air Force (IAF) began its fifth round of 'Garuda' exercises with the French Air Force at Jodhpur in western India on 2 June against a backdrop of increasing optimism over negotiations between the India's Ministry of Defence (MoD) and Dassault for 126 Rafale fighters in support of the IAF's Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft requirement.

The French are participating in the 10-day joint manoeuvres with four Dassault Rafale fighters and a KC-135 Stratotanker air-refueller. The IAF is fielding Sukhoi Su-30MKIs, upgraded Mikoyan MiG-27s, and MiG-21'bis' fighters.

Thales and Snecma, the two other original equipment manufacturers in the Rafale tender, are also part of deliberations that began in early 2012 after the Rafale was downselected from six fighter aircraft from Europe and the United States.

Industry sources believe negotiations for the Rafale purchase could conclude over the next few months and the deal possibly be signed off by Prime Minister Narendra Modi's newly installed BJP government by the end of the current financial year in March 2015.

Official sources said three of the MoD's four subcommittees associated with the Rafale purchase were on the verge of concluding negotiations on contractual offsets of up 50% of the overall tender price, technology transfer to locally build 108 Rafales and on logistics for aircraft maintenance.

The major stumbling block on the work share agreement between Dassault and Hindustan Aeronautics Limited to locally build 108 Rafales was resolved shortly before the Congress Party-led federal government was voted out of office in mid-May.

The fourth committee, related to contract negotiation will determine the fighter contract's eventual price, which is estimated to have doubled to more than USD20 billion. This was due largely to inflation, an appreciable decline in the value of the Indian rupee against the US dollar, and the addition of around 50 items that were not priced in Dassault's original bid.

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navyreco

Senior Member
It is online at last... I hope you guys will enjoy this! ;)

Video Report: On board FREMM Normandie next generation multi-mission frigate
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Navy Recognition recently had the unique opportunity to get onboard the French Navy's next state of the art frigate, the Normandie, while the ship was conducting sea trials off Toulon naval base in the Mediterranean. We already got the chance to get aboard Normandie while the vessel had just been floated out of dry-dock in Lorient, but this time it is a fully completed and functional frigate we got the chance to tour.
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