Fourth Taiwan Strait Crisis

kbecks said:

Its amazing how people here continue to try to blame the US and say they are starting this war, but also at the same time say that Taiwan is part of China and reunification has been in the cards for decades. Which is it?

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What??!! Your first statement is a result of your second statement; they do not contradict. Taiwan is a part of China so the US landing on Chinese territory without permission from Beijing is instigating the start to a possible war. What's contradictory in that statement?

gadgetcool5 said:

I believe China achieved a minor victory by not being goaded into shooting down Pelosi or doing anything drastic that would have prevented her from landing, just as I predicted. It makes Pelosi look like the instigator and China look like the reasonable party. The American "China hawks" are in truth deeply disappointed, since if China had used force, it would have strengthened their hand tremendously. Now they are denied what would have been a huge coup for them. Xi played this absolutely correctly. As for Pelosi, she will no longer be Speaker in six months. She is an old woman at the end of her rope. Tsai will also not be president of Taiwan in 2 years either. These two are has-beens who will soon fade away into obscurity as long as China remains calm.

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How will Xi deal with the PR of not intercepting Pelosi's plane? Chinese media has been hyping the populace up and to not do anything would a huge mistake.

Franklin said:

This simply shows you how irresponsible American leaders have become. That Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the house would create a international crisis for personal agrandissement. Because her visit was both opposed by the Pentagon and the White House so she is going their without any political, diplomatic or strategic initiative. Its nothing more than a personal photo op. And America and maybe the world will pay for that photo op.

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I think it's Sullivan's masterpiece. Never think the visit is opposed by White House.

FairAndUnbiased said:

That's insufficient. They already know about the SRBMs and IRBMs.

It demonstrates that China is willing and able to shoot down flying objects in Taiwan. Being a warmonger is better than being weak. Too bad it has come to those choices but it is what it is thanks to prior decisions.

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What about flying hypersonic gliders all over the island?

JewPizza said:

How will Xi deal with the PR of not intercepting Pelosi's plane? Chinese media has been hyping the populace up and to not do anything would a huge mistake.

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They are doing the exercises, but most of the populace will not eat it up.

kbecks said:

Its amazing how people here continue to try to blame the US and say they are starting this war, but also at the same time say that Taiwan is part of China and reunification has been in the cards for decades. Which is it?

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A country is in civil war with the UN only recognizing 1 side. Now the side without recognition is trying to gain access to foreign troops and material to aid their civil war against the main faction.

So who is the instigator here? You can argue for yourself that America is morally correct to instigate a war or whatever, but you're a blind idiot if you think they aren't the instigator.

You sound like one of those retards who blindly insist Putin isn't invading, just "denazifying".

Pick whatever side to support you want, although I myself don't really see how China has ill treated the population on Taiwan, just don't be blind to reality.

manqiangrexue said:

What??!! Your first statement is a result of your second statement; they do not contradict. Taiwan is a part of China so the US landing on Chinese territory without permission from Beijing is instigating the start to a possible war. What's contradictory in that statement?

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Ok so you're saying that Taiwan is part of China, so the US landing on China instigates a war between....China and the US?

Yet then China will use that to take over Taiwan? Seems like lots of excuses trying to blame the US for the reunification that China has desired for decades. If Taiwan is really part of China, you shouldn't need some visit from a foreign person to take it back - that's pathetic, it's yours go and get it.

Patchwork_Chimera said:

Thus, I don't think we can ignore the reputational damage that this has inflicted, even if it's fairly minor in the grand scheme of things.

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The reputational damage both inside and outside is huge. This is why I think China has not played its turn yet. I will be blunt. This is the biggest reputational disaster in PRC history if we won't see any further action.

Overbom said:

People are deservedly clowning the Propaganda guys, but we shouldn't forget that these old fossils were among the very first to wake up from hibernation in the late 2000s after sensing the danger coming from the West.

They are incompetent at their jobs, but they are very patriotic and vigilant people. But yeah, a change of guard is probably long overdue at that department.

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Patriotism alone won't make for competence, unfortunately. The patriots belong on audit boards, the judge's docket, and rubber-stamping policy through. The propaganda should be left to the literate, the media savvy, and the charismatic. Quite honestly, I would stay the same thing about the role of ambassadors. It might be a personal quibble of my, but Chinese diplomats and spokespeople need to be replaced with agile and energetic speakers that can run rings around journalists and foreign politicians, not whatever China is making do with right now.

gadgetcool5 said:

I believe China achieved a minor victory by not being goaded into shooting down Pelosi or doing anything drastic that would have prevented her from landing, just as I predicted. It makes Pelosi look like the instigator and China look like the reasonable party. The American "China hawks" are in truth deeply disappointed, since if China had used force, it would have strengthened their hand tremendously. Now they are denied what would have been a huge coup for them. Xi played this absolutely correctly. As for Pelosi, she will no longer be Speaker in six months. She is an old woman at the end of her rope. Tsai will also not be president of Taiwan in 2 years either. These two are has-beens who will soon fade away into obscurity as long as China remains calm.

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If that is their angle, then they never should have started with the rhetoric of fire and death. They should have clearly and concisely expressed their disapproval, repeated that there is only one China and that Taiwan is a part of their territory, and then punitively sanction Pelosi as well as all her friends and family. Deny her the public capital and propaganda win and hurt her in her greedy oligarchic wallet so other foreign politicians will think twice about overstepping China's boundaries. Honestly, by this point the PRC's brass should have someone with media training standing over their shoulders to advise them on what they should and shouldn't say and how much of their plans they should reveal.

siegecrossbow said:

What you said would be true if they didn’t play up the drama domestically and abroad. Now it has backfired tremendously.

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JewPizza said:

How will Xi deal with the PR of not intercepting Pelosi's plane? Chinese media has been hyping the populace up and to not do anything would a huge mistake.

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That's the one area where they could have handled it better. They need to do a better job at setting expectations.

"If that is their angle, then they never should have started with the rhetoric of fire and death."

This kind of rhetoric happens all the time though. The PRC's not the only one who does it. Trump threatened "fire and fury" comments, Obama's red line with Syria, even Russia threatening Finland and NATO. It's a good thing not every major nation feels the need to follow up words with actions, or else humanity would've destroyed itself a long time ago. The PRC's reputation will recover from this. What people will remember in the long run is Pelosi provoked but China showed restraint. That's a win for China.