CV-18 Fujian/003 CATOBAR carrier thread

delft

Brigadier
I'm not sure I understand your argument, do you mean that the wikipedia entry on the Yak-44 is not reliable and that it would have used smaller engines but still have been able to take off from a STOBAR carrier ?

How powerful do you think the engines would need to be for a plane that is better than a helicopter in the AEW role but can still take off from a STOBAR carrier ?
I haven't done the calculations but I remember reading a few years ago that Northrop Grumman had told the Indians that their E-2D would be able to take off from Vikramaditya.
 

delft

Brigadier
I haven't done the calculations but I remember reading a few years ago that Northrop Grumman had told the Indians that their E-2D would be able to take off from Vikramaditya.
I just looked at a photograph of the Yak-44 model and its propeller looks as if it could absorb more that the 5000 shp of the E-2D engines but 14000? Of course I don't know of an intermediate power Soviet engine.:(
Also be aware that an engine with contra-rotating propeller produced at low speed about 10% more thrust than the same engine with a single propeller.
 

schenkus

Junior Member
Registered Member
I haven't done the calculations but I remember reading a few years ago that Northrop Grumman had told the Indians that their E-2D would be able to take off from Vikramaditya.

Thank you for that hint, I now found some discussions and articles mentioning that proposal and why it wasn't taken up:

In particular
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quotes an Indian Vice Admiral: "In light conditions, the endurance of the aircraft goes down from five to just one hour. And for an early warning aircraft to have the capability of staying for only one hour makes no sense. We have decided not to consider the Hawkeye. There are other reasons for not taking up the Hawkeye offer. In a full take-off, a single engine failure could be disastrous"
 

delft

Brigadier
Thank you for that hint, I now found some discussions and articles mentioning that proposal and why it wasn't taken up:

In particular
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quotes an Indian Vice Admiral: "In light conditions, the endurance of the aircraft goes down from five to just one hour. And for an early warning aircraft to have the capability of staying for only one hour makes no sense. We have decided not to consider the Hawkeye. There are other reasons for not taking up the Hawkeye offer. In a full take-off, a single engine failure could be disastrous"
Indeed reason enough.:rolleyes:
The situation would be improved with cross-shafting between the engines and with the use of contra-props but probably not enough. Improvements in design software and fabrication technology will make producing the necessary gearboxes easier and get their weight down. These techniques should become more attractive attractive in many other situations if designers get the courage to look into these matters.

As for Yak-44 perhaps it shouldn't have big engines to take off from Ulyanovsk - there were to be cats - but to fly higher than E-2. But then I would be thinking of a wing sweep of some 25 degrees.
 

Intrepid

Major
A 190-meters take-off run with 25 meters wing span clearence needs more deckspace (4750 m²) than a 100-meters catapult shot (2500 m²).
 

delft

Brigadier
A 190-meters take-off run with 25 meters wing span clearence needs more deckspace (4750 m²) than a 100-meters catapult shot (2500 m²).
That's the trouble with long take off runs. Real estate on a flattop is really expensive. The best solution is a cat that gives the aircraft velocity an upward component. That reduces the speed necessary at the moment of leaving the deck. A well designed EM cat can compensate for engine failure during take off and so let the aircraft achieve the same speed with or without engine failure. This reduces the cat length necessary while increasing the safety of the system.
 

sangye

New Member
Registered Member
Thank you for that hint, I now found some discussions and articles mentioning that proposal and why it wasn't taken up:

In particular
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
quotes an Indian Vice Admiral: "In light conditions, the endurance of the aircraft goes down from five to just one hour. And for an early warning aircraft to have the capability of staying for only one hour makes no sense. We have decided not to consider the Hawkeye. There are other reasons for not taking up the Hawkeye offer. In a full take-off, a single engine failure could be disastrous"

This discussion reminded me of this video
I believe that if they can make a C-130 take off from a carrier without sky jump, it is very possible to make a smaller plane specialy designed do so in a carrier with skyjump
 
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