CV-16 Liaoning (001 carrier) Thread II ...News, Views and operations

[kwaigonegin]

The first Chinese night ops will be performed at full moon and with the sky clear.




I am an instrument flight instructor. In bad visibility at night all windows are black, at daylight all windows are white. You have to trust your instruments. Keep your eyes on them and concentrate on the glidepath. Remember: with 550 meters runway visible range you have 10 seconds from runway in sight to touch down. It is a deadly mistake to try to look out of the window to early.

Word!... Like I said in my earlier post the PLAN or any navy will plan their initial flights ops on a 'commander's moon' in very calm seas.

 

[kwaigonegin]

It is an honest question. I wasn't kidding. Neither was I to dismiss necessity and usefulness of such night CV ops back then.

But given that there are more and better sensors that work in night as well as in daytime, is it even possible to hide such a busy CV by simply turning off its lights?

You mean hide from human eyes?! Huh? The mk1 eyeball can see amazingly far in pitch darkness however odds are the CSG would've picked up the vessel long before the human could ever see it with their eyes even with binos not to mention the afterburners from the jets are far brighter than anything coming from the carrier!

 

[SanWenYu]

Hmmmm what has radar got anything to do with the lights?
As to the general lighting read my previous post on why the deck is not lit up like a Christmas tree. If you turn too many lights on the pilot may not properly see the actual landing lights on the angle deck. You don't want to get too distracted during landing.

In the middle of the ocean it is pitch dark! Especially on a moonless night! It's even darker for the pilot as the only thing he sees are his instruments and he actually has to reduce the instrumentation brightness otherwise his eyes would not adapt.

This happened on board CVN 76 a few years ago. This type of accident is call a ramp strike.

Perhaps I wasn't clear in asking the question.

My understanding is that, in early days like before and during WWII, it was necessary to keep the lights off in night to hide the CV from the enemy's naked eyes. Now with radars and other modern sensors widely used, darkness alone is no longer as effective to keep CVs under covered. Why would modern CVs still need to operate in such darkness?

Of course, lighting up the fight deck does not mean to turn on all the lights to their max strength.

My point is that, if turning on flight deck lights in night is no longer a major risk of revealing the CV to its enemy, would modern CVs consider to use lighting properly to help night ops?

 

[Intrepid]

On a carrier there are runway center line lights, runway edge lights, the ramp is illuminated, the runway end is marked, the drop line has lights and the landing mirror is illuminated.

 

[SanWenYu]

On a carrier there are runway center line lights, runway edge lights, the ramp is illuminated, the runway end is marked, the drop line has lights and the landing mirror is illuminated.

In addition to these, wouldn't a few flood light lamps help, in particular for landing? I remember that, from one video bd popeye posted a few pages back, the narrator said something like "when trying to land on a carrier in night, the pilots lose sense of depth due to the darkness".

 

[kwaigonegin]

In addition to these, wouldn't a few flood light lamps help, in particular for landing? I remember that, from one video bd popeye posted a few pages back, the narrator said something like "when trying to land on a carrier in night, the pilots lose sense of depth due to the darkness".

As has been mentioned numerous time here, you don't want the entire deck to be too bright because those bright lights will distract the pilots from seeing the runway lights during traps.

As to what the narrator was referring to, he was referring to the darkness in general not just the ship. For the pilot to totally gauge the depth for landing he has to not only see the entire ship but the sea as well. It would be impossible to light up the entire deck AND the sea all at the same time.

Also after flying in the dark for many hours you don't want to see something really bright shining at you especially when you're going to land on it.

 

[SanWenYu]

I mean, there must be a point between "pitch dark" and "really bright" that is able to light up the flight deck without blinding the landing pilots. No?

 

[Jeff Head]

The Liaoning and its CSG in the Pacific Ocean now.



You have to admit and give credit to the PLAN...their CSG is looking good.

 

[mr.bean]

didn't they just finished a training mission and returned to Hainan?

 

[KIENCHIN]

The Liaoning and its CSG in the Pacific Ocean now.

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You have to admit and give credit to the PLAN...their CSG is looking good.

That top view of the carrier with the parked J15's really put into perspective how large the planes are and the little room for error available. I can uderstand where Kwai is coming from on the question of why there has not been any evidence of night landings