Chinese submarines thread

[crobato]

Re: Chinese sub thread

The Russian tradition is actually a long rectangular sail without any diving planes, while the Western style is a more or less square sale with diving planes.

For a while, Chinese subs have been a mix of both---long rectangular sails with planes. Although I would say the Song looks more Western to me than Russian.

For me, the 092 or the 092A (which is what I would like to call the Xia class with the 16 tubes as seen in Google Earth) appear to be heavily inspired from the Russian Delta class. Rubin is said to have been an adviser in the nineties but then the definitive shape of the Xia class has long been laid down.

 

[Pointblank]

Re: Chinese sub thread

The Russian tradition is actually a long rectangular sail without any diving planes, while the Western style is a more or less square sale with diving planes.

For a while, Chinese subs have been a mix of both---long rectangular sails with planes. Although I would say the Song looks more Western to me than Russian.

For me, the 092 or the 092A (which is what I would like to call the Xia class with the 16 tubes as seen in Google Earth) appear to be heavily inspired from the Russian Delta class. Rubin is said to have been an adviser in the nineties but then the definitive shape of the Xia class has long been laid down.

The current Western trend is no diving planes on the sail, as they are moved onto the hull, for ice durability reasons.

 

[fishhead]

Re: Chinese sub thread

From the exhibition for this year's PLA day, 093

The official news site(sorry in Chinese), so it's officially confirmed

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093

091 mod

 

[Riverman]

Re: Chinese sub thread

:coffee: Hmm...can someone please translate?

 

[yehe]

Re: Chinese sub thread

hmm, I don't see a diving planes on the sail, or is it just the angle of the pic?

 

[kickars]

Re: Chinese sub thread

In the article it says the new 093 doesn't have a pair of planes.

 

[jackbh]

Re: Chinese sub thread

hmm, I don't see a diving planes on the sail, or is it just the angle of the pic?

093 doesn't have planes on its sail. It might be on other part of the body, but I don't know.

It says in the Chinese article that 093 can go up to 50 knots possibly making it the fastest sub in the world.

 

[bd popeye]

Re: Chinese sub thread

It says in the Chinese article that 093 can go up to 50 knots possibly making it the fastest sub in the world.

50 knots? jackbh I know you are just quoting what you read but..... I find that very hard to believe. 35-40 maybe. But 50? Impossible. The only surface ships that go near that speed are FAC and LCS types...

And this speed is being obtained by a navy that has just only begun to build nuclear powered ships? Impossibe.

 

[Roger604]

Re: Chinese sub thread

The article makes two remarkable claims.

1) Type 093 can go up to 50 knots

Popeye's right, this not possible. Yet, it may still be quite fast. Type 093 is China's third class of nuclear attack submarine. As the article points out, there was an improved Han-class in between (that's the scale model shown, with the diving planes on the sail).

2) Type 093 is as quiet as a 688 Los Angeles (noisier than the Improved Los Angeles)

This is not good enough for PLAN's requirements. It wouldn't last very long against the most advanced US subs like Virginia and Seawolf.



There is one possibility that hasn't really been explored. It's been commonly reported that the first Type 093 has been launched since 2000/2001. And another one followed up some years later. Clearly this submarine shown in the photograph is one of them. (If you zoom in, you can see there are people standing on the sail.) It's also been commonly reported that the first Type 094 was launched in 2004.

Is it possible that these three ships are all interim designs, since they must reflect the same level of technology (which means they are all too noisy)? Just like there are huge differences between the Type 054 Frigate and the Type 054A Frigate, each interim design can bring huge improvements.

The timing is interesting too. China has a habit of bringing some project into public only when the successor is well on its way. There was a three year gap between the first Type 093 and the first Type 094 (2001-2004). Probably the second Type 093 was launched in 2004 as well. That means the next three year period would fall in 2007!

My guess is that these pictures were released because a new design has been launched recently -- possibly both a Type 093 and a Type 094. This is consistent with reports (relayed by our own TPHuang!) that some time ago, a manufacturer claimed they were producing components for a "Type 095". It's likely this is actually one of the Type 093 variants, which was still in construction then.

PLAN is certainly going to try to bring down the noise level of these submarines to something reasonable. Perhaps the initial interim designs were intended to test the propulsion and other systems, leaving the quieting modifications for later. If they can bring the broadband noise from 130 dB down to 110 dB, that would be acceptable, I think.

According to some Chinese sources, Type 093 is (or will eventually be) capable of 110 dB at tactical speeds. If it's launched in 2007, it could enter service as early as 2009. The Type 095/096 is probably a totally different generation of submarine that, according to Kanwa, is in the finishing stages of design, and so won't be launched until 2012 at the earliest and probably enter service around 2015.

 

[Riverman]

Re: Chinese sub thread

093 doesn't have planes on its sail. It might be on other part of the body, but I don't know.

It says in the Chinese article that 093 can go up to 50 knots possibly making it the fastest sub in the world.

50 knots...yeah right :rofl: . The russian Sierra class and U.S Seawolf class does ~35 knots.